The Demands Objectives Committee met today at 1300 hrs, October 1, 2011 on the west side of City Hall. Attendees: Mat, Wendel, Lala, Julia, Eanna, Alyassa, Booker T., Jerry, Doug, Jessica, Arturo, CJ, Richard, et. al. (If I have forgotten someone's name please let me know)
Ground Rules:
Ground rules for future meeting were layed out to ensure that we have an open and democratic process where all ideas are given equal weight and all feel welcome to offer their ideas in a transparent and postive setting. The following ground rules were established:
1. Rotation of Chairperson for each meeting, time keeping, and to respect each others opinions and to keep all discussions poltical and not personal.
2. Meeting duration should be one and a half hours.
3. Meetings will begin at 1730 hrs Mon thru Fri. or as designated by attendees. The meeting location will be on the west side steps of City Hall.
Discussion: It was decided, with unanimous support, that our first discussion should be general in nature to get a sense of the temperature of the attendees and at later meetings the Committee would work toward formulating a more detailed and specific declaration.
Members in attendance agreed their might be some overlap of ideas between all national Occupying Groups (OGs) and coordinating efforts should be established by the appointment of a national committee liason. Wendel Eckford volunteered. A point was raised that although we should show solidarity with all OG's we must develop our demands as they pertain to Los Angeles. It was also agreed that a research team to include Wendel Eckford and Alissa Kokkins will make up a Reaseach sub committe within the Demands Committee. Their goal will be to provide intellectual, politlcal and phiosophical support for the Demands as they are generated.
It was noted that the initial goal by Occupy Wall Street was to go after the corrupton by investement groups on Wall St. However, the Los angeles Demands Committee noted that there are other goals, i.e. nationalizing of banks, and job creation, specifically that should be one of the central demands of Occupy Los Angeles. The creation of employment should include specific job creation for transgender, women, legalization of immigrant workers, and a political move away from both the Republican and Democratic parties.
As a movement we should understand the pwer of ideas/words. Our language needs to be tailored to our communities consciousness to ensure maximum strength of our demands. The committee should explore concrete demands of what people are experiencing in the present, for example home foreclosures. We should work toward attracting working people and demand full employment and for all and for workers to have the right to join a Union.
Our demands must be specific and concreate, i.e. "Double the minimum wage" rather than "get a living wage." The movement should link up with rank and file workers. We as a group undersatnd that the Democratic Party will not break with Unions so we must appeal to workers directly.
Our demands must link the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan with communty oppression. Homelessness must be abolished as everyone should have the right to a home, right to health care and education.
Matt passed out a draft "Proposal For Demand Guidelines." The Committee accepted the draft and discussed the goals of the document. Matt stated that as we are all in agreement with Occupy Wall Street Declaration their message may be too complicated for the people and media. We should simplify the WS Declaration to ensure that our Demands are concise and understandable by the people. At some point it may be appropriate to present indepth policy but not at this particular point. It was noted that our Demands must include the destruction of the ruling oligarchy.
The "Proposal for Demands Guidelines" included the following:
Banking Reform
a. Stronger regulations
b. Enforce Investment Banking Transparency Laws and Guidelines
Tax Reform
a. Consider the Warrent Buffet Tax proposal and ensure wealthy pay their fair share.
b. End Bush Tax Cuts
c. No Offshore jobs without a stiff tax penalty
Campign Finance Reform
a. Repeal the "Citizens United" Supreme Court decision - Corporations are not people.
Economic Policy Reform
a. Stop all Wars
b. End Poverty
c. Keep Social Security Strong
d. Bail out the poor
e. Fund education not the military
f. Keep Unions strong
g. Return TARP funds to the people
Healthcare Reform
a. Public healthcare option and Universal healthcare
Respectfully, this is too broad. When Paulsen came to congress for the 700 billion he had one sheet of paper. One sheet of paper that spelled disaster for this country. The banks made the rules, they will not keep their own laws. Our government is in bed with the banks. Remember, it was Pelosi and Frank, democrats, who pushed for the bailout. Rebublicans would have never bailed out the banks. We need the 700 billion back; we need forgiveness of the forclosed mortages; and we need forgiveness of outrages credit and school loan debt. And, we need the backs and AIG and Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac to be brought on charges. Period!
nore more special treatment to corperations and governmental agencies..........
No more retro active immunity from prosucution. no more violations of the Contitution.
If we get them to repeal SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY FROM PROSRCUTION GIVEN TO JUDGES FOR TAKING BRIBES AND ALL THOSE INVOLED IN GIVING THE BRIBES.) THIS SHOULD ROCK THEM TO THE CORE.
HISTORY OF RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY IN THE UNITED STATES
1. given for unconstitutional use of torture
2. given for illegal merger of banks (we can see the effects of that now)
3. given to telecom company for illegal wire taps. (Fisa bill that led to the patriot act)
4. given to Judges for taking bribes. (SBX211)
SBX211 Retro Active Immunity given to California judges for openly taking bribes. Judges are employees of the state they receive their pay and benefits from the state. The Los Angeles Superior court judges are currently receiving an additional $57.688,00 from the county of Los Angeles. there is no bigger user of the court than L.A. County.(A party to the case and has a financial interest in most cases in the courts) Those payments were found to be unconstitutional / illegal in Sturgeon vs Los angeles County. After that decision the judges paid a lobbyist to pass SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY )
SBX211 does not restore due process
SBX211 violates Article 1 section 9 (no ex post facto laws shall be passed )
SBX211 violates the 14th amendment (no equal protections)
SBX211 violate checks and balances between legislative and Judicial powers.
Judges do not disclose the county payments at the onset of any trial where the county is either a party to the case or has a financial interest. (Judges violate Judicial codes of ethics)
Judges refuse to recuse themselves when requested under CCP170
Judges find themselves unbiased and then file an order striking statement.
SBX211 is evidence of conspiracy of the California legislative branch of government to cover up the multiple felony's committed by the Judicial branch of government. By an act of Legislation, California's judicial branch has admitted to be corrupt.
SECTION FROM SBX211
This bill would provide that no governmental entity, or officer or employee of a governmental entity, shall incur any liability or be subject to prosecution or disciplinary action because of benefits provided to a judge under the official action of a governmental entity prior to the effective date of this bill on the ground that those benefits were not authorized under law.
Robert kennedy spoke out against retro active immunity..."QUOTE" (The very idea of "retroactive immunity" ... is so radical, so repugnant to the most basic principles of the "rule of law," that only one prior attempt can be found in recent history (at least from my research): the efforts by some in Congress (in 1965) to enact a law retroactively legalizing the mergers by six large banks which clearly -- as a federal court found -- were illegal under our nation's antitrust laws.
The banks knew when they merged that they were almost certainly violating anti-trust laws. But they did it anyway. And when courts began ruling that their behavior was illegal, they ran to Congress to demand that a law be passed granting them amnesty, claiming that the consequences would be ruinous if they were held accountable under the law. ) But the very concept of retroactive amnesty, the idea that corporations could break the law and then have Congress pass a special law legalizing their lawbreaking conduct, was so profoundly offensive to Sen. Robert Kennedy (who had been the Attorney General when the banks broke the law with their mergers), as well as then-Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach, that they engaged in extraordinary efforts to try to put a stop to this Congressional travesty.
Robert Kennedy was NOT able to stop them at that time in our history. What will happen in the future now that it is legal for judges to take bribes? How could you bring evidence of corruption and violations of the LAW when you have a court that has been granted RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY for taking bribes.
REPEAL SBX211
THIS SHOULD BE A VERY SIMPLE DEMAND FOR EVERYONE TO AGREE WITH.
NO ONE SHOULD BE ABOVE THE LAW. CORPERATIONS AND GOVERNMENTAL AGENCIES SHOULD BE HELD TO THE SAME STANDARDS OF THE LAW AS THE 99% ARE HELD TO THE LAW.
If we don't do this we should all go home and tell our children that we were too chicken s**t and we leave them with a mountain of debt and a corrupt government........
We are to provide a new guard for our future security. This guard has been developed by 99ers from Scandinavian countries. After 200 years of refinements two states adopted this new guard as well as 25 OECD nations. We commission plenipotentiaries with the mandate to carry out indictments of corrupted government personel. We the people commission government agents, politicians to run government to function as intended. We the people commission New Guards as adopted by 39 governments to investigate corruption preventing government to function as intended. These Jason Bourne plenipotentiaries end both corruption and police abuse as they investigate all agencies. They are not chicken. Your thoughts?
Hi guys, I'm posting the full "Proposal for Demands Guidelines" as was mentioned so that we have it here in the full electronic version. See it below. And when Wendel said it was "accepted by the committee" in his post above, I believe he meant "received by the committee"...point of clarification...:-)
Also, Wendel, thanks so much for taking notes at the meeting and posting this so quickly today.
Furthermore, after listening to the many comments and suggestions at today's 1:00 meeting, we are definitely getting closer to some direction on this committee. The ideas presented at the meeting definitely illustrate that this rough draft start proposal below needs a lot of work. Of course, it was only intended as a rough start that we could use as a base.
Also, despite my imploring that we aim for simplicity and "General Demands", I believe that the point made by Quasi and others about our demands becoming quite concrete is very important. If we can say things like, "We demand a doubling of the mimum wage" as opposed to "We demand increased wages" we are presenting no uncertain terms.
Also, there was a great point made about "maximizing our demands". The counter movement is going to want nothing more than to minimize our demnds or even reverse them. We have to start from a position of greatest ideals and potential. Example, "End the wars, NOW!", not "Gradually pull the troops out by 2014".
Quasi also made excellent points about making our demands relevant to the CURRENT expressed demands of the people right now. For example, "We want jobs now", "Stop foreclosures now", "Expanded VA benefits for veterans now", "Stop ICE raids and deportation on immigrants NOW"...etc., etc. He is right that more people will believe in the movement if it addresses the current overwhelming grievance relevant RIGHT NOW.
Also, Ali made a good point about making a version of our demands as advertising-like Slogans that can be easily read and understood by the press and the people. I think that there is room for BOTH the Slogan-like appeal as well as the more concrete demands. The two can co-exist. Some are great on signs, and others are great in formal press releases when the time comes to present our official demads and grievances.
Anyway, below was my original draft proposal, open to scrutiny and critique.
Occupy Los Angeles
A Proposal for Demands Guidelines
(Unofficial, not to be interpreted as an official List of Demands)
Our goal must be to influence policy by our policy makers in office, but also to inspire the people to join a political and cultural movement.
This means we must put our demands in terms that can be clearly understood by our local politicians who serve us, and everyone else.
Our politicians and our media need to hear clear, concise demands that may very well reflect the same, redundant political demands we hear in the news today or when politicians are on the campaign trail. Why? Because our local politicians need to be able to latch on to a communicable platform, with which they can then take to the local, state, or national congressional arenas to enact change. No amount of rage changes the political process. We must hone the rage.
At the same time, we have a message to deliver to the general public. This too must have a clear, concise delivery that informs at a practical level, but also inspires.
Yes, we have a long list of complicated grievances and demands, but we cannot have a long list of rambling grievances and demands that clouds the message for each demand. This proposal implores a plan of action that states a list of “General Demands” which can be broken down into “Specific Demands”. Because each is complicated on its own, the “Specific Demands” can be broken down further via addendums and clarification through official press releases.
Ultimately, these General Demands must be written as a statement that reflects all demands and grievances stated, sort of like the preamble to the Constitution.
We must also make the people, corporations, and politicians aware of the consequences of Demands not being met, and in no uncertain terms.,e.g., ;
“If our demands are not met, we the people will exercise our consumer RIGHT and CIVIC duty to withdraw our money from the banking system and initiate a run on the banks, plunging our nation and the world further into economic disaster, so as to force the issue with our policymakers to listen and act on the demands of the people who really should have the power, we, the other 99%.”
We the people are commissioning a New Guard for our future security. This guard has our mandate to deliver the demands of the 99ers. If you fail to run our government as intended this guard will bring you up on indictments.
We are always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption.
I was thinking that we needed a Demands thread in the General Discussion Forum in ADDITION to this internal Demands Committee forum. Sure enough, someone already created it 3 days ago. This is good. We need a highly accessible Demands solicitation arena. I may even suggest to the moderator of this site to create a Demands thread under the major Forums heading. Apparently there is a moderator who can only do this.
The Demands Committee can hopefully serve as a consolidator of solicited Demands for when it comes time to propose to the General Assembly or to issue official, collective Press Releases.
Restoring the fairness doctrine for broadcast media (i.e. public spectrum.)
Political advertising on broadcast media required to be non-profitable to broadcasters as a condition of licensure, with minimum time alotted and equal access to opposing positions.
Although this may seem to be detail, it's core to taming corporate influence on multiple levels.
Does anyone not understand the basic message, the one basic demand of this protest???
"THE BASIC MESSAGE OF THIS PROTEST IS that Wall Street is oozing corruption and criminality and its unrestrained political power—in the form of crony capitalism and ownership of political institutions—is destroying financial security for everyone else." (Glenn Greenwald)
The corporate monster is an extremely difficult one to address, and we must keep our energy focused in solidarity. If this movement is to be successful, it must stick to its guns on this ONE UMBRELLA DEMAND: RESTORE OUR DEMOCRACY BY ENDING THE CORPORATOCRACY. We must, at all costs, remain in complete solidarity behind this one basic and general demand, and not veer into discussion of other demands that do not fall under this umbrella. If corporate money were taken out of American politics, and the American government were to become what it perhaps once was and what it has always aspired to be -- a participatory, truly representative democracy -- the public would have a renewed opportunity to express themselves through legislature and public policy, and demands of various stripes would be heard and met. But at this crucial turning point in this particular movement, OTHER DEMANDS, WHILE OF COURSE VERY VALID, WILL ONLY UNDERMINE OUR STRENGTH because, by definition, they do not have the support of the 99% who are being financially victimized by the 1%. They are other issues that could begin to be solved once the MONEY IS OUT OF POLITICS. This is the one issue we can and should ALL get behind. In order to continue gaining momentum and growing in numbers, this must remain our one overarching demand.
I move that Occupy Los Angeles adopts and releases the following demand declaration, or something similar, as soon as possible:
***
"DECLARATION OF THE DEMAND: Our one basic demand is an immediate end to the corporate rule over our representative democracy. We will take all patient and deliberate actions necessary to ensure that our one demand is met as soon as possible. We recognize our demand is a general one; it must be so, because it is in response to a endemic problem with multifarious faces. Rest assured that in the coming days, weeks, and years it will be followed by more specific demands with more focused targets. We will vigilantly continue our Occupation of Los Angeles until the crux of our one basic demand is met. We will know that day has come by the shared happiness we will experience as one people, when equal access to resources and the overall equality of wealth have manifested through the demise of the corporate monster."
***
Then, as a demands committee, a general assembly, an occupation of L.A.'s City Hall, and a national movement of occupations, we can move on to discussing more specific actions and demands that help achieve the basic demand.
I write these comments after attending three meetings of the Demands Committee, listening carefully to everyone's inidividual ideas about the movement's demands, and doing more research and coming to understand the nature of what is happening at City Hall in Los Angeles now as it relates to what has happened and continues to happen on Wall Street. Over the last 48 hours in protest mode, my concerns about the demands of "Occupy Los Angeles" and "Occupy Together" in general have grown and changed. We must retain our solidarity on the umbrella demand of the movement so that we can begin to work on strategies to begin to win small battles towards achieving that basic demand. For those who do not understand how the corporatocracy is stealing our money and ruining our lives, education and outreach programs should be set up to show how all problems stem from the larger economic issue of corporate rule."
Please discuss and revise as necessary!!!
Daniel Brummel
¡¡¡ EL PUEBLO UNIDO JAMÁS SERÁ VENCIDO !!!
FIRST THEY IGNORE US, THEN THEY LAUGH AT US, THEN THEY FIGHT US, THEN WE WIN
I agree that it's essential to keep it simple and keep it focused. It's also essential to remember that this movement goes nowhere if most people don't feel it strikes a chord with them. However much I might agree with many of the points on any of the laundry-lists I've seen circulating, the question is, how many people NOT occupying could even begin to relate to them. Not so long ago over 50 million within the 99% this movement purports to represent the interests of voted for Bush...which I mention only as a reminder of where much of this country is in terms of opinion and consciousness. The challenge is to engage without compromising core values or aims.
The protests in Israel (the Tentifada, see https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/2011_Israeli_social_justi... and note that around 5% OF THE POPULATION PARTICIPATED, which would be equivalent to over 15 million in the U.S.) offer a good model in the sense that their core demand is simple and practical: affordable housing. Everyone can understand it and few can unashamedly oppose it. They are making demands of their political system, but regardless of their sympathies, they are not (yet) siding with any party.
I'd suggest the sentence:
"Rest assured that in the coming days, weeks, and years it will be followed by more specific demands with more focused targets. "
be revised:
"This core demand creates the foundation enabling broad-based action towards practical objectives, directed towards redressing the injustices brought about under corporate rule and building a sustainable, functioning economy centered around human needs. "
which embraces so many of the laundry-list points without assaulting the people we should be trying to win over.
I agree with Daniel Brummel - the movement would benefit by agreeing on one main demand. Other issues will inevitably come up, but one basic rallying cry will help galvanize a greater % of this 99% we speak of.
I think what he proposes sums it up well: end corporatocracy, restore democracy.
Last night’s general assembly perceived a need for a simple & unified statement to widely and effectively propogate the Occupy message.
There are many more complex issues. This message is consciously brief and simple.
1. War We are here to express support for the October 6 Freedom Plaza Occupation. After 10 years of continuous war it is time to end U.S. military actions in Iraq, Afghaistan, and Libya. Bring the Troops home now.
2. Banks & Debt Slavery We are here to express support for Occupy Wall Street. We do not accept the manipulation of our economy by corrupt banks and financial traders. We oppose the manipulation of U.S. and world economies by central banks such as the Federal Reserve and IMF which expand their power by driving a majority of the U.S. and world populations into Debt Slavery.
3. Democracy & Corporatism We are here in recognition of the fact that our democratic electoral process has become corrupted by corporate and banking interests. The majority of elected officials no longer serve the American people. We seek true democracy free from the manipulation of corporate and bank agendas. We seek government By the People For the People.
4. Non-Violence We are committed to peace and non-violence. Our strength is through numbers and consensus. We do not use force or aggression to achieve our goals.
This document is offered Open Source with Love for Occupy LA and all Humanity
There are obviously many currently existing modes of operation that need adjustment if not outright dismantling. I just read the declaration of occupation by our brothers occupying Wall Street and I am worried that we will become the Democrat's Tea Party. It is my humble opinion that if worry too much about jobs, wars, immigration, environment, poverty, education, etc., and while they are all worthy causes, we will be bouncing from subject to subject with no clear objective giving the current perception of the movement, that the goals are unclear, that much more resource.
In speaking with several individuals attending the GA, at work, with my employees, with my vendors,with my suppliers, , etc. it is clear that it is the bailout where many can agree that a great injustice has been served. I mean even staunch Tea Party members that I have had discussions with agree that the bailout was irresponsible, not logical, backwards, confusing, harrowing to those that lived within their means, harrowing to those that are being foreclosed upon, suffocating to those under the load of student loans, etc.
What do we want?
ONE: All the companies that were bailed out need to come forth now that we are in calmer times and be sold by individual asset to the highest bidder. I want my company, my neighbor's company, my house, my neighbor, my favorite restaurant, my best friend's son, my fellow brothers and sisters in occupation, etc. to be able to buy their financial obligation at auction. The auction needs to be public and give everyone the ability to buy whatever indebtedness controlled by the parties involved to be up for sale to an individual. NO BUNDLING OF ASSETS.
TWO: Give interest expense a geographical boundary. This can be accomplished by passing laws that empower more credit unions to serve local communities. This can be accomplished by forbidding the sale of trust deeds, educational loans, car loans, life insurance, credit card loans, and any other form of financial obligation, to those that have no personal connection to where the debt originated. With the increasing of local power, we may even find ourselves where even insurance companies should be fragmented. I mean if I could buy Sylmar insurance and I get in a fender bender with someone from Sylmar, I am most likely to come to an amicable result, which rarely happens now. Credit unions should be locally owned and not for sale to a party that does not live within the community it serves.
There are no more demands, just two; and if we are able to sound this off over and over with accuracy and intelligence, what an incredible and powerful people's mic that would be.
Embracing unions is an incorrect move. After all, it is not just banks and other companies that would have been decimated if the financial crisis had happened, as it should have. Unions would have been decimated as all unions have members dues tied up in assets that would have had a day of reckoning as well. Pensions and other savings vehicles would have gone to zero and unions would have disappeared in their current form. Obama was served with an opportunity that would rival, and by any means not be a close second to what Lincoln faced in the 1860s, but a second never the less, if he would have forced the carrying out of the laws that already existed and are used for those that cannot meet their financial obligations, yes, chapter 7. The move to have been calculating really would have been "CHANGE" and those opportunities to make social change with one action just do not come that often in history. He failed us because unions have just as much political clout, lobbyists, personal interest, etc. as corporations, and that is probably why he wavered. Well, while the current proposal would not subject the asset destruction as wide spread, as the financial crisis would have, unions could be allies but should remain at an arm distance.
Incidentally, point one could be forced and it would be the greatest move of social peaceful disobedience ever. I will refrain in the offering of how that could be accomplished at this time, but it is simple, effective, and would get attention very quickly.
I leave you with the words of Thomas Jefferson that predicted we would get to this point:
I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlighten, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.
Introduction of facilitators and explanation of their roles (Moderator, Stack Keeper, Timekeeper, Note-taker)
2.
Reminder of hand signals and their meanings
3.
Reading of the minutes from the previous meeting
4.
Updates (GA Assembly meets, Research info, etc.)
5.
Discussion/Debate/Proposals of the topics at hand (items to be included need to be discussed before close of the previous meeting and agenda drafted immediately thereafter)
*Note: Members have asked that most pressing topics be dealt with first.
6.
Wrap the meeting (confirmation of points/updates/proposals/temperature/vote TBD at GA meeting if applicable)
7.
Draft Agenda for next meeting (including identifying facillitator)
*This is the agenda template that we agreed upon and utilized yesterday to keep us informed, on track and productive. If there are no concerns we can continue to use this model. If any arise please bring up in the next meeting.
He still holds one of the most influential positions in this country.
It was clear that Obama wasn't going to force change as soon as he appointed Larry Summers and Tim Geithner to the influential economic positions that they took. Summers is out, Geithner is still in.
I need to first Thank all involved in New York for having the balls to Start the original movement.
I also need to thank all those in L.A. who so quickly & magnificently, demonstrated the same set of cahonies by following in kind, here, on the West Coast. RESPECT TO YOU BOTH!
Now, with no Disrespect implied or intended, I will put forth my feeling's & concern's for the List of General Demand's being prepared by us here on the "Best Coast" as compared to the original charter as prepared by our Brother's & Sister's back east on the "Least Coast", I'm kidding you Madison Ave. Maniac's.
The following "Mission Statement" is copied directly from the Occupy Wall Street home page. It is quite a bit different than the "General Demands" being kicked around for us here in L.A.
Occupy Wall Street is leaderless resistance movement with people of many colors, genders and political persuasions. The one thing we all have in common is that We Are The 99% that will no longer tolerate the greed and corruption of the 1%. We are using the revolutionary Arab Spring tactic to achieve our ends and encourage the use of nonviolence to maximize the safety of all participants.
Last night’s general assembly perceived a need for a simple & unified statement to widely and effectively propagate the Occupy message.
This initial comment reflects the OWS agenda, but quickly disembarks from direction when when the Bring the Troops home general demand is posted. We are now no longer "THE 99%", we have just pissed off the small percentage of those who disagree, probably most from the right, with that demand, we are now "The 85% (+/-)",
Embracing unions is an incorrect move ...He (Obama) failed us because unions have just as much political clout, lobbyists, personal interest, etc. as corporations, and that is probably why he wavered. Well, while the current proposal would not subject the asset destruction as wide spread, as the financial crisis would have, unions could be allies but should remain at an arm distance.
I know several Union/Trade member's who are 100% behind Occupy, these are Electrician's, Carpenter's, Plumber's, Welder's, ...etc. By your statement, the majority of these guy's would feel singled out & uneasy, the majority would walk. So now "The 99% > 85% will be more like The 65%", see where I'm going with this?
The Brilliance of this movement is the simplicity of it. It has ONE FLAVOR that Everybody likes & can get behind on, But when we start turning it intro a 51 Flavor thing, we will splinter, we will list, we will sink.
I guess it's up to the OLA committee leaders, another partial stray from the "Leaderless OWS" agenda, to decide on our demand's, so remember, you represent The 99% going in with a blank page. What you put on that page will determine The XX% you will now represent going into battle.
Think long and make a wise decision for the Greater Good of us all, please.
My picture reads
"Sell a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you ruin a perfectly good business opportunity."
I say this with all respect, but how are most of those issues going to help the 99%. All we are doing is addressing too many issues that will shatter our Unique Solidarity, that includes all parties, races, genders religions & most importantly, those who have for the first time in their lives, got up & off the couch to participate in a possible Historical event.
We will receive a label from the overly redundant reporting news networks by the end of the weekend, as well as several people dissecting the topics being brought up by Swanson to try & find some idiotic Secret Social Agenda held by Occupy.
All I and anyone else who understands & agrees with my ranting (apologies) can do now is Hope for the Best & Prepare for the worst.
Turn out The Light's The Party's ...... :(
My picture reads
"Sell a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you ruin a perfectly good business opportunity."
1. End the Federal Reserve. It needs to go. This means Congress and the President order a resolution to dissolve the Federal Reserve. They're one of the prime instigators in this entire mess.
2. Congress passes a resolution to fix all real estate land values and write off all defaulted home loans and student loans. $20,000 an acre for residential, $80,000/acre for commercial. Home values will be based entirely off the condition of the house, and the materials used to build it (and the fixed cost of the land with 20% sales tax).
3. Single Payer Healthcare. Federal, of course.
4. End the IRS and institute 20% federal sales tax. No more payroll tax. Eliminate all other taxes. No one gets past with loopholes (eg corporate write-offs). Estates, investments, savings and capital gains are not touched. The public coffers will overflow.
5. Gut out the racist/classist DEA, ATF, and all other crony buraeucracies. Dissolve them. They waste money and resources, and accomplish nothing productive (they make the problems worse). Leave substance regulation to the states.
6. Immediately repeal the Patriot Act.
7. Regulate the Federal Government. Any money a public official receives that is not part of his salary will be met with Federal Prison sentence. No more special interest lobbying to politicians, period.
8. A new legislative system that requires politicians to obtain consent from their constituency (by vote) before petitioning bills to congress (both senate and house). Lobby organizations can only lobby the populace for votes. If a lobby organization presents a media campaign to the public, it must be counterbalanced with the opposite view from an opposing organization to ensure fair and free information is being propogated to the masses. No longer can politicians be bribed... they MUST obtain voter approval before submitting bills.
9. Publicly financed campaigns with equal airtime. Prospective office holders must pass vigorous background checks including all business associations and a deep probe into their personal lives (character and integrity). They must also have fully-formed bill proposals ready, a planned agenda, and full approval of a citizen's investigative commitee.
10. Require that corporations be 60% employee-owned with only a 40% margin for free trade on the market. Employee shares are equally distributed by each employee, and employees are actively involved in decision-making meetings.
11. Insititute equlization of trade through fair trade tarriffs. Price foreign-made goods at a comparable price to a domestically-made counterpart. Force corporations to bring manufacturing and jobs back to America, and to stop enslaving third-world countries.
12. End all foreign wars. Authorize domestic oil drilling again so we can become energy self-sufficient and end reliance on OPEC. Federal fianancing into alternative energy sources so that we can move forward from oil quickly.
13. Ban imminent domain.
14. Part-time legislature in congress. Congress convenes only twice a year (Spring, Fall) for two weeks at a time. Only the office of the President is year-round, with all other government agencies.
15. End all corporate subsidies. No more corporate welfare, ever.
I absolutely agree that the Federal Reserve must be eliminated, because this unelected body of private (and secretive) bankers somehow get the authority to control the money and credit supply, in such a way that benefit themselves and their elite associations.
So I think the first objectives of the Occupy movement should be to educate and be educated about the role of money/credit supply in all levels of economic conditions.
Concomitant with financial/economic reforms should be government reform that completely removes money/lobbying/bribery from the political process. Instead, the political process should be based on rational process and empirical data.
Other reforms such as healthcare or education can be debated later, once more people involved in the reformation process become more educated in the role of government intervention and the good and bad consequences. For example, true free market (little to no government intervention, let market derive true costs to public) versus socialist system (high government intervention thru high taxation to guarrantee free healthcare or education, with potential abuses always).
I personally think it is premature to demand a minimum wage (especially an absolute value that can be meaningless in high inflation) and free education or healthcare when we don't know how much that would really cost in terms of taxes.
This is an idea that I've had for a while, that might have some legs... and I'd like to know what other people think of it.
Basically, my proposal is that we get rid of States altogether and force a more sensible localization of power - to the city level.
Right now, states are responsible for governing very diverse populations living in very different environments, with very different needs. Cities are struggling to make ends meet and sustain their communities even as the pool of federal and state dollars is sucked up into war spending and funding federal attempts at fixing what's broken, and being spread too thin throughout states.
It's been encouraging to see the LA City Council support Occupy LA, and previously to see mayors around the country speaking out for a real end to the war in Afghanistan. The people who are actually responsible for governing - not just legislating - seem to have a better pulse on the needs of the people.
City leaders would be in charge of governing, all taxes would be paid to one's city. Perhaps each city would then pass on some tax dollars to the federal government, which might still be in charge of foreign affairs and national security. And, since cities controlled the purse, there'd be more oversight and control over how we let our federal government do those tasks.
We could create a new governing body with one representative from each city, town, municipality, etc. Elections would be localized and thus potential be less prone to fraud. Judicial responsibilities would also stay local, and communities would be more responsible for dealing with their own people's behavior. Community would be stressed. People could take pride in their city, and what they actually contribute to it - not just have some detatched jingoistic nationalism.
That's the basic idea, lots of room to run with it. It would be an interesting and maybe feasible way to restructure the system and remove current power structures without completely removing a working civil society.
I've said this several times before. But we NEED to identify the root of the problem. Yes we are all protesting Wall St. greed, we're protesting how the financial sector bought and paid for preferential treatment and bribed its way out of accountability.
But what does that mean? The system failed us! but how did it fail? Simple, there is one problem: Money!
Money is an inherently coercive force, it's the grease that keeps our economy and lives going but at the same time money and pursuit of money must be seen as what it is, inherently a tainted pursuit. That however DOES NOT mean I am anti-capitalist or advocating any radical alternative to our current system. But what I am advocating is this, we must remove the ability of money to influence our institutions of power.
To that end I have analyzed how we got here, how we were sold out and became stooges to the entire corporate world.
1: Money in Politics (How the laws get written) 1a: Mandatory public financing for ALL elections Why: If money determines one's ability to be elected, one is naturally beholden to those with money, which is an abdication of an elected official's patriotic/official duty.
1b: Ban soft money why: Issue ads are a way to launder money and peddle influence deceptively. Issue ads should only be allowed for ballot initiatives, be publicly financed or outright banned. One's voice in politics must NOT be determined by the size of their wallet. This is a primary way to silence good ideas and subvert democracy.
1c: Declare elections day every two years a national holiday and make voting compulsory. why: We cannot consider our republic to truly represent the will of the people if half of the nation does not vote.
1d: Some form of proportional representation and instant runoff voting for ALL elections. why: We must break the two-party system to be free from this tyranny. Even if it is not necessarily a direct cause of our current situation its continued existence greatly enables it and its removal would do wonders to further our democracy. We need to lower the barriers to entry in politics so that people can gain legitimacy and the public can express finely nuanced support for who they want in power.
This lets the best ideas win and the best candidates get elected. We must reject party ID, the big two cannot represent America.
2: Money in the Courts (How the law gets enforced and how people are able to pursue claims under it.
2a: Expand and improve the public defender program for civil cases. why: One of the ways that companies have subverted our essential freedoms is through manipulation of the civil court system. One's ability to pursue a valid legal claim is entirely dependent on their ability to finance a legal team. I REJECT the idea that JUSTICE should EVER be determined by money. Every time a person appears before the court we must provide them with equal legal representation to their counterpart.
It is only through having a fair and equal ability to pursue a claim under the law that justice can be served.
2b: Damage Caps against individuals and families. Why: We need tort reform! Not for big business but for families! Did you know the RIAA can sue you for up to $150,000 per file downloaded from your machine? They then use the fact that with little evidence they have the ability to reach for a damage award that works out into the billions of dollars if they so choose.
They use this threat to force families who have no money to defend themselves to settle out of court and it only hurts everyone involved. Court awards are meant to be consumerate to actual harm done. We've used statutory damages in many cases as an excuse for a business being unable to tell us how much they were really harmed and now families are suffering.
2c: Bankruptcy reform Why: Going with the above we must make it easier for individuals to escape onerous debt. Many bankruptcy reforms passed recently have reversed this trend. Making it easier for the wealthy to escape their debts but not those most vulnerable. We must ensure that no human is ever forced into generational poverty or debt slavery by big business. Especially when considering the ridiculous litigation that can be brought against families.
3: Money in the Media (How, as gatekeepers of our national discourse the media can manipulate and directly shape public opinion.)
Preface: This area is most contentious. But we MUST reform the media. While a private enterprise we must understand again, that the objectives of journalism, insightful, hard-hitting reporting that shakes people up, is at odds with the for-profit motives of a business. Thus I advance we must consider News and journalism a public good. It's utility is vital to a functional democracy and we cannot deny that the media whether or not it did so knowingly did not set off warning bells sooner and is by and large doing more to protect corporate interests then to foster insightful dialog in the people.
3a: Clear Media Labeling why: One of the first ways media has gotten around lying and misleading us is to blur the line between News and entertainment. We allow people to drink and smoke tobacco, but we clearly label each for the harm it does to our bodies. As such I advance that we must clearly label "entertainment news" versus actual journalism, for the irreparable harm so-called "entertainment news" can do to one's mind and perspective.
If someone wishes to push an agenda it is their first amendment right to speak about it. However no person should ever be allowed to institutionalize deceit in the pursuit of their agenda. If they want to lie then it is their right, but it is within our rights to declare that anyone wishing to do so cannot legitimately claim they are their to inform and educate.
We must label all "entertainment news" clearly and prominently wherever it appears, and clearly label all honest journalism where it appears.
3b: Bring Back the fairness doctrine. why: The second danger in the media is how it can practice viewpoint discrimination and shape public opinion by presenting dishonesty and rhetoric as honest debate. People parroting talking points are considered "experts" and never questioned on their credentials. We must not allow people to create their own "media fiefdoms" where they dehumanize their opponents. This does not serve any legitimate public interest and as history has now shown it fosters a real danger in forwarding eliminationist rhetoric as valid.
All journalistic news must be considered a good to serve the public interest, and an honest debate of ideas always does that. Business will tell you this is discrimination and that it is restricting their free speech rights. But think about that for a second, what is it they're saying they want to do?
They want to use their "free speech rights" to deny another person's ability to speak in defense of themselves so that the business can proceed to lie, call them names and tell people how they 'ought to be shot in the head. Since when does freedom of speech mean freedom to capture an audience and then preach they should violently overthrow those you dislike?
Again, it is one thing for a person to do this. It is another for any business that wishes to be legitimately journalistic. These are not restricting the rights of the people, only the rights of companies to divide and conquer the people.
3c: Empower the FCC to investigate and fine news organizations if they are proven to be intentionally lying, misleading or otherwise pushing an agenda. why: We empower the FCC to do many things and it does them well. Despite its mandate to protect children from ever knowing the human body exists it does not somehow drown under complaints.
As news organizations have a duty to inform the republic we must create mechanisms for the public to bring legitimate grievances against news companies. We must provide avenues to ensure, just as we do with every other institution of power, that they might be checked in their excess should other checks fail.
3d: Mandatory disclaimer or source reporting for all articles of news.
Why: Another critical avenue to detect faulty journalism is in evaluating one's source of information. We must know when someone is basing their pieces on their own opinion, on research, on interviews, etc. For simple interviews listing a first and last name of the interviewed is fine.
That said it is also crucial that we enable whistleblowers and others to provide anonymous information to the press. As such I forward also that any time an anonymous source or whistelblower is used for an article of news we simply put a disclaimer on the piece and then list that of course an "Anonymous" source contributed to the article.
All of these proposals are non-partisan, all attack our core problem, money and greed have taken complete control of our country's power structure. Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, whatever you are, YOU believe in a prosperous America. YOU believe in freedom, liberty and justice and YOU know what's wrong and that we haven't been doing what we should to fix it.
So rather than get into an argument about ideology, or where we might have legitimate differences, I speak to you all in solidarity that we as a whole must take back our country. This is how, we must remove the ways they usurped our ability to stay informed and elect who WE THE PEOPLE wish to elect, and not who makes the most backroom deals during the elections cycle.
What you guys are doing is impressive and exciting! Onwards!
Respectfully, my suggestions are (and please forgive any redundancy or if you guys are already implementing these):
- Study the history of successful social movements from around the world. Also read ongoing advice to the Occupy movement by social movement experts as quoted in the media.
- Coordinate with New York on the list of demands. NYC should be calling the shots. This will facilitate organization and efficiency.
- The demand list should be brief and focus on campaign finance reform. I like Daniel Brummel’s “Get Money Out of Politics”. I also think Fallout2man has nailed it on the head: the source of all our problems is the unfair influence of the 1% via money. This is where the message and demand list must focus! (Fallout2man, didn’t you have prior posts? I just saw your 5:16pm post but where did your others go?)
- Once the message and demands are clear and public, once the organization and outreach is effective and streamlined, it’s necessary to show a sign of force: select one day where you ask everyone to call in sick, take a vacation day, do what you must to show up for one day only, especially if you’re unemployed! Truly Occupy LA. Such a show of force will send a clear message to the 1%: the 99% can mobilize when called. Ideally, this should be done on a nationwide scale. This will also build momentum and bring more people into the fold who are sitting on the fence/in their cubicle. Such a show of strength and organization is crucial if this movement is to survive.
Comprehensive Lobbying Industry Reform is needed to insure transparency within our Government
While lobbying could have a positive effect on Government because it provides knowledge in a particular sector of an industry, it can also be perceived as way to bribe Elected Officials, its influence can have a negative or unintended consequence on the way Legislation is written or how Contracts are awarded to benefit a particular industry. The idea is to limit monetary contributions to minimize the influence and to put restrictions on Government Officials and the Lobbying Industry and the so-called Revolving Door. For example in 2010 Federal Officials accepted over $3.5 billion in contributions, while the number of registered lobbyist decreased the contributions actually increased. This site offers a tremendous amount of research and detail data that can be broken down by Industry or Firm contributing that money and who specifically received it, or what bill exactly it was trying to influence!
In addition to campaign contributions to elected officials and candidates, companies, labor unions, and other organizations spend billions of dollars each year to lobby Congress and federal agencies. Some special interests retain lobbying firms, many of them located along Washington's legendary K Street; others have lobbyists working in-house.
Although the influence powerhouses that line Washington's K Street are just a few miles from the U.S. Capitol building, the most direct path between the two doesn't necessarily involve public transportation. Instead, it's through a door—a revolving door that shuffles former federal employees into jobs as lobbyists, consultants and strategists just as the door pulls former hired guns into government careers. While officials in the executive branch, Congress and senior congressional staffers spin in and out of the private and public sectors, so too does privilege, power, access and, of course, money.
The most disturbing fact is the Chamber of Commerce practices and influence on Govenment using non-profit Organizations like ALEC American Legislative Exchange Council to draft Legislation that in turn is secretly voted on by Elected Officials and CEOs of multinational Corporations to push their Conservative Agenda from a variety of issues that range from Environmental or Financial deregulation to limiting Voter Rights, etc. A concerted effort to undermine True Democracy at work. Approximately 1000 bills a year are introduced and over 25% become Law.
Here is a link with detailed State by State information on Legislation drafted by ALEC, the Corporations and the Elected Officials affiliated to them.
I will be at OccupyLA this weekend and would like to discuss the possibility of mounting a direct political action to shut down proposed House and Senate bills that propose to give multinational corporation a tax giveaway on offshore profits. I am still in the research phase of this effort and am working toward preparing a action proposal to be presented in the near future at a general assembly.
This bill, which effectively is a needless tax giveaway to the most powerful multinational corporations, constitutes legalized theft and exemplifies the corrupt practices that brought the Occupy movement into existence.
These bills have some support in both parties, with the only area of disagreement focusing on how the reduced tax revenues would be spent. What I would like to achieve with this action is to develop and incorporate an opposition strategy (i.e., legislative outreach, oped opinions, thematic inclusion in protests, etc.) as part of the Occupy movement against unfettered corporate control of this country. Occupy has shown the world that it has a voice. I want to show the corporate elites that we have teeth as well.
For those interested, here are links to some recent articles and studies:
These two sources should give people a good picture of what's happening on this issue.
Look forward to talking to somebody this weekend.
Sincerely,
Robert Perry (a.k.a. bdop4)
P.S., here's the text of the Bloomberg article:
Corporate repatriation legislation proposed by Senators Kay Hagan and John McCain would let U.S. businesses bring home offshore profits at an 8.75 percent tax rate.
The rate on repatriated profits would drop to 5.25 percent if a company’s payroll expanded during 2012, according to a summary of the bill released by Hagan’s office. The current top corporate rate is 35 percent.
To qualify for the lowest tax rate, a company would have to increase its payroll by 10 percent as measured by additional workers or higher employee pay.
“I want to use every tool in the toolbox that’s at our disposal to help our economy and put people back to work,” Hagan, a Democrat from North Carolina, said in an interview on Bloomberg Television today.
One of Hagan’s corporate constituents, Charlotte, North Carolina-based Duke Energy Corp. (DUK), is a member of the WIN America Coalition, a group of multinational companies lobbying for a tax holiday on as much as $1.4 trillion in offshore profits.
WIN America campaign manager Karen Olick called the Hagan- McCain proposal “a critical step forward in the effort to jump- start our economic recovery.”
The Win America group supports the Hagan-McCain initiative and a House measure sponsored by Representative Kevin Brady, a Texas Republican, coalition spokeswoman Abigail Gardner said in a telephone interview.
Brady and House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, a Virginia Republican, issued statements praising the Hagan-McCain bill.
Cantor said the measure was “the latest evidence of bipartisan support for repatriation and I applaud their effort.”
“I hope that Congress can act quickly so that the president can sign repatriation legislation that will take effect this fall,” Brady said in a statement.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said yesterday that the proposal from McCain, an Arizona Republican, and Hagan won’t pass the Senate as a stand-alone bill and must be coupled with infrastructure improvement provisions.
“It won’t just be simply repatriation,” the Nevada Democrat said. Corporate tax holiday legislation “will be part of an infrastructure program,” Reid said in an interview. He declined to provide details.
2004 Tax Holiday
Independent studies showed that when a tax holiday was last offered, in 2004, the lower tax rate for returning profits spurred little hiring or domestic investment. Most of the money was used to buy back stock. Democrats have said they are concerned that could happen again with a tax holiday.
Under the Hagan-McCain proposal, if a company repatriates profits and then reduces its staff, it would be required to add $75,000 to its gross income for every position eliminated.
That differs from Brady’s legislation, which would require a company to increase its taxable income by $25,000 for every position cut. Brady’s bill would allow companies one year to repatriate offshore profits at a tax rate of 5.25 percent.
The congressional Joint Committee on Taxation has estimated that a tax holiday would cost the Treasury $78.8 billion in forgone revenue over 10 years if the money was brought back to the U.S. at a tax rate of 5.25 percent. [This estimate is low IMO].
Tax attorney H. David Rosenbloom said that adding to a company’s gross income, as the Hagan-McCain proposal does, may be friendlier to business than adding to its taxable income because it provides more chances to whittle down a tax liability through the use of deductions and credits.
“Generally, the higher up on a tax form the number appears, the more opportunities there are, the more things that can occur, said Rosenbloom, a partner at Washington-based Caplin & Drysdale Chartered and director of the international tax program at New York University’s law school.
Rosenbloom said lawmakers were embarrassed following the 2004 repatriation when some companies that participated in the tax holiday eliminated jobs.
‘‘This is basically to keep Congress from getting caught red-faced again,’’ said Rosenbloom.
Chuck Marr, director of federal tax policy at the Washington-based Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, which advocates for low-income people, said the Hagan-McCain proposal contains no incentives to create jobs.
‘‘The lower rate strikes me as a fig leaf,’’ Marr said. At 8.75 percent, companies ‘‘are getting a very low rate with no strings. It’s a 75 percent discount.’’
Infrastructure Bank
Senator Charles Schumer of New York, the chamber’s No. 3 Democrat, said in June that Senate Democrats might be open to using the short-term revenue provided by a corporate tax holiday to finance an infrastructure bank.
Using proceeds of a tax holiday to pay for infrastructure projects would mark a difference between Senate Democrats and the Obama administration. The administration has said it won’t consider repatriation outside of a broader tax-code overhaul.
A coalition of businesses, including United Parcel Service Inc. (UPS) and Boeing Co. (BA), which are lobbying Congress for a lower corporate tax rate, did not comment directly on the Hagan-McCain proposal.
‘‘We view the repatriation issue as something that should be considered within the context of a comprehensive reform of the corporate tax system,” Jim Pinkerton, co-leader of the RATE Coalition, said in a statement.
Two other measures that address repatriation are pending in Congress. Legislation proposed by Representative Shelley Berkley, a Nevada Democrat, would let companies bring home offshore profits at a 25 percent tax rate, and lower if they increase their payrolls.
Senator Mike Lee, a Utah Republican, has proposed an amendment to a currency bill now being considered that would lower the tax rate for returning profits to the U.S.
I've posted here before but then most of the forums stopped appearing on the site. I've been refining my points as I talk to people so you'll find various revisions of the same over various comment boards on OWS for news media sites. But my larger goal is to help the movement by honing messaging and ideas to a razor's edge. So I want to talk and engage as many people as possible, debate and do my best to find good ideas and speak for them every chance I get. Secondary to that is work on messaging and sort of honing the tenor of any official demands or goals. We must remember, good politics is inseparable from good policy. The best plan in the world is useless if no one will vote for it.
We know what works, we know what we need to do, maybe not individually but as a whole, and do you know why? America is SMART, it just doesn't always apply its full potential. The process though gets short-circuited when petulant children attempt to manipulate human nature away from pragmatism in government. Suddenly honest debate becomes impossible because you have parties not advocating that they must tackle a practical problem or solution, at this point you just have parties arguing so they don't win or lose elections.
Every time I'd see an idea that made sense die, it died not because of legitimate objections in the congress, it died because people just did or did not want to vote for something. There's another reason we elect representatives. It's because we don't want to have to do all of the math ourselves and do the really HARD work at figuring out ideal policy and balancing concerns. We elect people specifically to do this hard work, but long ago as a society we lost track of something.
People aren't always rational, people aren't always going to make the best choices, and you can't force anyone to make a choice. But what you CAN do, is you can empower everyone with the facts and you can empower them with debate and inclusion to air their grievances. If done right then the side who has created the strongest case should prevail and obviously any legitimate minority concerns should be addressed. And after that? Well, kids will be kids. If someone insists on being a goose they aren't going to stop whatever you do. We must understand that absolutely any society will have professional malcontents whose aim is only the pursuit of institutional power to further their own personal greed and whose tool is a cunning wit and intelligence. It is beyond our ability as a species to truly know another's intent. But it is not beyond our ability to judge the effects of their actions when they reveal to us in advance their plans.
Here are some key principles I'm trying to refine/convey regarding I guess my grander ideas regarding government and the good/bad of the current system. I'm probably going to revise it more, but everyone, please if you have comments or ideas respond. I'm sure we can make a truly excellent proposal together. So right now consider the below my "CURRENT" interpretation of how things are and how they went wrong with a bit of possible solution fit in. Not so much a list of demands in this case but rather what I would hope to be possibly the start of a new attitude and philosophy in general towards government and governing.
Principle Concepts
1: Governing IS PRAGMATISM
Any vote without a clear and reasonable justification (which should be recorded for posterity's sake) should be considered an act of contempt against the American people. And any politician who consistently votes not on the facts, not on informed and well-researched studies that show what the potential effects, ups and downs of a policy are, and instead chooses to vote entirely on ideology, emotions or other nonsense should be given a swift boot from office.
The best remedy I can see for this is to adjust the barriers for entry into politics so that one's ability to get into office rests soley on their ability to sell their ability to empathize with our problems, identify them, and efficiently solve them and to be an effective advocate of their solution.
Right now a lot of paralysis is happening because of three sources
A: People think their vote doesn't matter (often because no elected official represents their more nuanced positions)
B: People vote for the "lesser of two evils" instead of who they really believe in because of party politics,
C: Because of the above two it serves to destroy the ability for politics to change at anything other than a glacial pace. Essentially politicians aren't even jockeying for the hearts and minds of voters anymore. They're jockeying to increase election turnout. Each year the Democrats hope more people vote and the Republicans hope more people stay home. Their actual support bases never change, only elections numbers change. What few good politicians do get elected slowly find themselves burried under the weight of those who wish to do nothing other then play electoral games.
That to me suggests that people are not being given an ability to make their voice heard in politics. We need to allow new people or parties to appear when there is an urgent need. But most importantly we must divorce "party" from "power" in politics.
A politician should be elected on their capacity to solve objective problems and advocate those solutions effectively, NOT which party they belong to, not because they can out fund raise their opponent. They should be elected because they've done their duty and they know about real problems Americans face, they've got the facts and they've got a solution. Parties should only exist to provide an ability for those with like minded ideas to organize and effectively research, debate and hash out policy.
They should not decide who gets to run, they should not influence who gets to run, they should not decide who sits on what committee. Indeed, Washington himself warned us of the danger of parties. There is also however another danger we must also remember, we elect representatives also because they will be willing to do the hard work and research on ideal policy. That also means that the other half of that is when they find an ideal policy that may not have public support but they know is ideal it is their duty to educate and inform us on why we should also believe it's ideal.
What defines Tyranny is not an arbitrary threshold of pain and suffering, but rather when a choice is unnecessarily forced. Therefore a majority may not be tyrannical if a minority cannot make a sound, logical case for why the choice made was unnecessarily forced upon them.
2: Government must be INCLUSIVE
All must be given fair, just and most of all EQUAL treatment under the eyes of the law. We must understand then that money works against this. Those institutions within which we divest power must put this duty before all else. Once you are elected, whatever sort of a person you were before, you are NOW GOVERNMENT and you must discard any part of your past, present, future or person which would in any way impede that duty. There are other areas I'd like to tackle such as lobbying reform but I'm not entirely versed on the laws and policies related to lobbying yet. I may add it as a subsection, it is for exactly that reason that we must reject identity politics.
A person's identity should never disqualify them from holding office. But if a person is beholden to THEIR identity and not to THEIR DUTY, then they are committing an offense so supreme it should almost be criminal. Fortunately we can prevent this simply by embracing a policy of all-inclusivess: And any person or group which centers their IDENTITY around denying or disenfranchising another group should not be given any ability to enforce that belief in practice in their capacity of an elected office. We must SHUN at every instance those who would insist that their freedoms are abridged when they are not allowed the "Freedom" to make use of government office to enforce their own private animus whether towards an individual or group of any kind.
3: Money IS coercion.
Legal tender in all forms is coercion, it is unique in that this is an unavoidable byproduct of money's purpose. Legal tender enables society and commerce but we MUST remember what those things are. They compel someone to perform an act for someone else. It's a mutual agreement but it is still a DEMAND. Money enables us to command others to do as we wish, not in every case or every form but it enables us to form power relationships with one another to achieve specific means.
So money becomes a natural power relationship. It is the grease that enables us to pursue our dreams by soliciting compliance. So the act of giving money to a person is therefore always an act of control because it will always universally ease the effort one needs to expend in controlling others. It creates a connection within our minds and it creates sources and structures of dependence and necessity. So collusion of money is also collusion of power. And what happens when power colludes? Dictatorships, regimes, horrible things that just shouldn't happen.
This doesn't mean money is always bad for us, or a universal evil that need be expunged. For certainly we can see how society has developed both for better and worse under its reign. Which brings me to my next point:
4: CAPITALISM within reason
Capitalism is all about enabling the ideal flow of goods, services and power amongst the people and institutions of the day. It was rooted in certain enlightenment ideas about people and human nature that we know were partly true and partly not.
Capitalism is not a tautology though! We use it because it works, and when it does not work we revise it! Thus we must understand that consumerism is also not inherently moral either. It is not universally good but not bad either. When is harm done? When it is unnecessarily inefficient. Just as I spoke earlier about the pursuit of money being an inherently tainted one, capitalism is a means to an end, and should NEVER be the end itself. We believe in capitalism because we believe that a market economy is a good way to get certain tasks done.
For as much as we know there is still so much more we do not. We as a people wish to naturally pursue certain ends and as a collective society of Americans we wish to pursue these ends together. Thus the duty of both the government and the market is to be the means to achieve these ends as efficiently as possible.
Thus we must always put a fine toothed come to BOTH to ensure that they are doing their jobs. The private sector is not a tautology, the invisible hand of the free market is not an omnipotent, omniscient being which will guarantee optimal prices. Why is this? Because one of the most fundamental principles of any functioning market is the ability of consumers to obtain all information needed to make their purchasing decision and understand it.
Unless all humans are omniscient this is simply impossible in some cases. Therefore we must understand that certain needs or goods which provide immense benefits are not always ones a person is capable of making an informed decision about. Key point: Pharma companies, why do we allow them to advertise directly to consumers? A consumer has not gone through medical school, a consumer does not know medicine, and they do not know how to gauge whether or not a product has truly succeeded or failed.
You know who will? Their Doctor! So why do we allow this? Does this serve anyone's freedom? We must REMEMBER, the private sector can over-reach just as much as the government into our lives. When is there over-reach of either? The moment a case can be made that a choice was unnecessarily forced by either. Look at what Mastercard and others did to wikileaks. Private businesses decided to unilaterally refuse service and because these PRIVATE COMPANIES control so much of what we use to conduct 21st century commerce they effectively removed an entire organization's ability to function and for no other reason than "Just because we wanted to!" Does this mean that we should enact drastic changes to contract law or nationalize the credit card companies? No not necessarily that at all. But what we MUST HAVE are mechanisms by which society at large may enforce consequences against bad actors in the private sector.
Voting with one's dollars is all but a myth, thanks to globalization, technology and many other changes we have centralized business to such a point that it diverts power in few individuals to make sweeping choices over all sectors of the world. Could we just boycott Visa, Mastercard, Discover, Amex and Paypal? No! we'd be just as cut off as wikileaks was, and that's the point. No rational human being will give up their ability to be paid or pay others just because of wikileaks. Does it in any way lessen the supreme wrong done? No, but it does underscore the point. Government provides us a mechanism to remove malefactors from its places of power, business does not provide a comparable alternative. Are we to starve and choke the gutters with the dead every time we wish to remove them from the private sector?
Finally
5: Liberty is choice, it is good because it empowers us to be happy, and for choice to be empowering it must be MEANINGFUL
A lot of the doublespeak we get from our current politicians is filled with poisonous disingenuity with regards towards liberty. Liberty is at its core, the ability for each individual to pursue their happiness, a guarantee to every American by the constitution. As such though liberty is defined by being given a choice or set of choices rather then being compelled to take only one path.
But merely being given a choice is not enough if those choices are meaningless. For WHOSE LIBERTY do you advocate? For WHAT AIM do you desire freedom to accomplish? HOW does the presence of this choice enable greater happiness than would be there if it were not? Is my choice to use an inefficient incandescent light bulb so I can save $0.10 per bulb when for that extra $0.10 my bulb will last ten times as long and I will be 25% more likely to still have an earth to enjoy in my golden years?
Such choices are absolutely meaningless because they have in effect already been made for us. Being offered a choice of "Heads I win, tails you lose" is not freedom, it is the ghost of freedoms robbed from you. Should an individual be able to use incandescent light bulbs they have? Absolutely! that choice enables them to find meaning and value without cost, should we allow individuals to MAKE incandescent light bulbs? If it can be done without causing great harm I see no reason why not. Should we allow businesses to continue manufacturing incandescent light bulbs en masse? Only if it could be said that a public need were reasonably being serviced in a way not otherwise achievable. If the choice is between saving ten cents or getting extra efficiency plus saving the environment then that choice does not serve any purpose except to act as a weapon of mass distraction by politicians wishing to steal your true freedoms out from underneath you.
For indeed it is often these same politicians who have divided us and separated us by manipulating sentiment, by manipulating identity. They have balkanized the American people to maintain their power. But while sunlight is an excellent disinfectant I would also put forth that an even greater one is: The Question. How do you know if a politician is lying or misleading you? When they do not have a completely valid case of facts behind their decisions in office. It is not that they use sound bytes or dodge questions, this is merely a symptom they use to cover the fact that they have made a decision not in the true interests of the American people. If they cannot articulate that to you when asked they are either a failure as a politician for improperly doing their job at advocacy or are a failure of a human being for purposefully abdicating their duty to ensure all decisions made in office are sound.
Now, happiness is a very nebulous and personal concept. So exceptional care must be made with regards to limiting the ability of individuals to pursue their own forms of bliss. We must be inclusive without alienation, but we must be wary of ANY who refuse to include themselves unless we meet demands of alienation or tyranny. If I cannot be happy if my neighbor's mailbox is blue and not red is it my right to demand to the city he change it? No, for what is guaranteed is the pursuit of happiness, and not the conclusion. All demands are not reasonable and while it should be my right to pursue him in changing it, it is NOT my right to enforce it. It is NOT within my rights of free speech to harass him, spread damaging lies about him, or insist that he is spreading a "Blue Agenda" and then to petition government that they must immediately recognize my freedoms by requiring he change his mailbox. It is NOT within my rights to demand that the government increase his taxes or DECREASE its service to my neighbor because I refuse to allow "My taxes" to fund his "Blue agenda."
The question that never gets asked is why this choice has any real meaning? Why is it so important he change his mailbox? What is it that I seek to achieve by doing this? If I simply cannot stand blue mailboxes it is obviously I who 'ought change and not my neighbor. If I am merely offended by the color blue then that choice is meaningless. Offense may be taken for any cause, just as all demands are not reasonable neither are all offenses. Does the color blue harm me in any way? does it harm him? For if the only harm done is an offense to my eye or ear then again, that offense is not reasonable. It is through this sentiment that we can at last notice how business has used doublespeak to turn freedom on its head and weaponize it to great effect against us.
We are told that the choices that do matter don't and the ones that don't matter do! We are told that it is important we allow mercury and lead in our drinking water because it saves money! Yet we have a vested interest in enshrining entirely subjective morality into law. I REJECT this, I reject the belief that encourages selfishness as the only definition of happiness. If you cannot be happy unless your way of life is the law, then you do not deserve to be happy. But do NOT confuse to whom I am addressing that statement. It is to those who define their way of life as hatred, it is those who define their way of life as intolerance, it is those who cannot be happy unless ALL children are learning bigotry in school for no other reason then they cannot stand the loss of control they suffer when their own children do not grow up just as filled with bile as they are.
These people were entirely created because of money, because of structures of power. They are the unfortunate effects of human nature. Business funnels no small amount of money to these individuals and seeks in no small part to engorge their ranks as often as they can. They give paid-for media megaphones to blast their vitriolic message of misinformation across every corner of the nation, spreading lies and misinformation under the guise of authority. They prey on human nature, on trust and they hijack religions they hijack politics, they hijack unions, they hijack movements. They use their influence and hammer, chip and grate away at us until we start to believe them and then, after finally collapsing intellectually under the sheer weight of their ability to divide and conquer us they pit us against one another so we would never realize how it all got started. That we would never realize who our friends and enemies really are.
We all can achieve equality and justice under the law, there is no reason that your freedom and my freedom should EVER TRULY be in conflict. And anyone who tells you otherwise is TRYING TO CONTROL YOU! (or has been coerced into it by someone else who is) Yes, there is some overlap. The rights of individuals to freely organize is tantamount to democracy and the foundation of this movement. But the right to freely assemble is one thing, the right for individuals to reach a collective decision is one thing. It is another when you enter a legally binding contract to enter a commercial enterprise? Why? It all goes back to money, money IS coercion, and while money is not evil the pursuit of money is the pursuit of power, and it must be regulated justly so that neither may create tyrants over our lives.
Profound analyses, I think your level of discussion is deep and it will take me and many others some time to digest the message. I hope your viewpoint gets consideration when the Occupy movement can translate its action into national reforms.
Who regulates money? Policy by reps keeps money regulated among we the people. Reagan's voodoo policy was a departure. Our New Guard Association is always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption. Your thoughts?
The basic Principle of "Occam's Razor", slightly modified from the original authors, Franciscan friar William of Ockham, meaning, "In most cases the simplest choice is the best choice." I realize that a statement like that made here, in California, is not very popular, where we like to do everything the hard way
If Occupy plans on folding up the tent's for good, after our initial campaign, I would agree to a All Inclusive, Multi Issue Document of Our most Critical Path Issues and our solution's, feasible or not, that would prevent our country as well as the world from a permanent Economical melt down. But that's not the case.
We need to formally introduce ourselves to the World as a Brilliant Anomaly, something the Modern World would witness for the first time,
A Pure, Unified & Unconditionally United American Public, with no political or ethnic or age or gender labels, all with the same goal clearly in mind, for your review and comment, my drafting of a "Declaration of Re-Occupation by the 99%"
"REFORMATION OF THE FINANCIAL CRISIS IN AMERICA BY REMOVING THE OVERWHELMING IMBALANCE OF POWER AND PROTECTIONIST LEGISLATION CREATED THROUGH THE LOBBYIST SYSTEM BY FAVORS, PROMISES AND MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL COMPROMISES THAT HAVE INFLUENCED OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS AND CAUSED THEM TO WILLFULLY ACT WITH A RECKLESS ABANDONMENT AND IN TOTAL DISREGARD TO AND FOR THE BEST INTEREST OF THE VAST MAJORITY OF THOSE WHO RESIDE IN THE USA, AMERICAN CITIZENS AND OUR WELCOMED IMMIGRANTS ALIKE, THE 99%.
THESE WILLFUL ACTS HAVE FURTHER RESULTED IN LEGISLATIVE ACTIVITIES PROVIDING FEDERALLY PROTECTED AND PREFERRED ISOLATION OF THE WEALTHIEST 1% OF AMERICAN'S. ABANDONING THE 99% TO THE DISASTROUS FINANCIAL AND ENVIRONMENT CLIMATE THEY HAVE CREATED.
REFUSAL TO WILLFULLY ACT IN PARTICIPATION TO RESOLVE THE HORRIFIC CLIMATE THEY HAVE CREATED, AND REFUSAL TO SHOW THE SIGNS OF REMORSE WITH THE ACKNOWLEDGED RESPONSIBILITY, MUST BE CONSIDERED AN ACT OF TREASON. THAT SHOULD BE DEALT WITH SWIFTLY, STRICTLY AND WITH THE SAME COMPASSION THIS GROUP HAS SHOWN THE 99% TO DATE."
There you go, I realize that the act of treason might be a bit harsh and extreme, but that's how I feel about the mess we were presented with by them.
My picture reads
"Sell a man a fish and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you ruin a perfectly good business opportunity."
We the people are to provide a new guard for our future security. The simplest choice is the best choice. They have been dealing out indictments for over 200 years. We are always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. Simple? All we need do is pressure congress to fund our New Guard. The council supervises this guard and thats it, pretty simple. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption.
HISTORY OF RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY IN THE UNITED STATES
1. given for unconstitutional use of torture
2. given for illegal merger of banks (we can see the effects of that now)
3. given to telecom company for illegal wire taps. (Fisa bill that led to the patriot act)
4. given to Judges for taking bribes. (SBX211)
SBX211 Retro Active Immunity given to California judges for openly taking bribes. Judges are employees of the state they receive their pay and benefits from the state. The Los Angeles Superior court judges are currently receiving an additional $57.688,00 from the county of Los Angeles. there is no bigger user of the court than L.A. County.(A party to the case and has a financial interest in most cases in the courts) Those payments were found to be unconstitutional / illegal in Sturgeon vs Los angeles County. After that decision the judges paid a lobbyist to pass SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY )
SBX211 does not restore due process
SBX211 violates Article 1 section 9
SBX211 violates the 14th amendment (no equal protections)
SBX211 violate checks and balances between legislative and Judicial powers.
Judges do not disclose the county payments at the onset of any trial where the county is either a party to the case or has a financial interest. (Judges violate Judicial codes of ethics)
Judges refuse to recuse themselves when requested under CCP170
Judges find themselves unbiased and then file an order striking statement.
Not only do judges get paid a state salary of $178,789.00 a year with medical and retirement benefits up to 75% of their salary, with the county payments the Los Angeles Superior court judges are the highest paid judges in the Nation. Los Angeles County takes tax payer money and then gives the judges that money to only have the judges rule against the tax payer in favor of L.A. County or the County's interest. THE BRIBES WORK.
SBX211 is evidence of conspiracy of the California legislative branch of government to cover up the multiple felony's committed by the Judicial branch of government. By an act of Legislation, California's judicial branch has admitted to be corrupt.
SECTION FROM SBX211
This bill would provide that no governmental entity, or officer or employee of a governmental entity, shall incur any liability or be subject to prosecution or disciplinary action because of benefits provided to a judge under the official action of a governmental entity prior to the effective date of this bill on the ground that those benefits were not authorized under law.
If government would only adhere to their sworn oath to uphold the Constitution and the laws we would not be in this horrible mess. But instead they take bribes/ campaign contributions and either give massive bail outs or they violate the Constitution by granting Retro Active Immunity from prosecution.
Robert kennedy spoke out against retro active immunity..."QUOTE" (The very idea of "retroactive immunity" ... is so radical, so repugnant to the most basic principles of the "rule of law," that only one prior attempt can be found in recent history (at least from my research): the efforts by some in Congress (in 1965) to enact a law retroactively legalizing the mergers by six large banks which clearly -- as a federal court found -- were illegal under our nation's antitrust laws.
The banks knew when they merged that they were almost certainly violating anti-trust laws. But they did it anyway. And when courts began ruling that their behavior was illegal, they ran to Congress to demand that a law be passed granting them amnesty, claiming that the consequences would be ruinous if they were held accountable under the law. But the very concept of retroactive amnesty, the idea that corporations could break the law and then have Congress pass a special law legalizing their lawbreaking conduct, was so profoundly offensive to Sen. Robert Kennedy (who had been the Attorney General when the banks broke the law with their mergers), as well as then-Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach, that they engaged in extraordinary efforts to try to put a stop to this Congressional travesty.
If Robert Kennedy was able to stop them at that time in our history then we would most certainly not be in this position today. What will happen in the future now that it is legal for judges to take bribes? How could you bring evidence of corruption and violations of the LAW when you have a court that has been granted RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY for taking bribes.
The change must start with the courts. Without a fair and unbiased court you can not have JUSTICE, YOU CAN NOT HAVE THE RIGHT OF DUE PROCESS. In the constitution the right to due process is stated over and over again. Our founding fathers knew the dangers when judges could be bought. They knew the dangers when the financial institutions became too big.
CURRENTLY THE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF CALIFORNIA IS IN NEGOTIATIONS WITH BANKS, THE BANKS ARE REQUESTING AMNISTY / IMMUNITY FOR ILLEGAL PORCLOSURES.
I agree that demands should be kept short, simple and doable. I love all of the suggestions but I think they need to be sorted into short term/long term.
For short term, I would love to see two:
1) Pay Ceiling. Enact a law that states that no one at a company may be paid higher than 20 times the average salary of a companies work force.
2) Reduce work week from 40 hours to 32 hours.
I've posted an article at http://www.narfus.com/node/11 explains my thinking and why these two demands go to the heart of a large inequity Its a bit long for this forum.
Thank you, all of you, for all you're doing. OWS rocks.
Last Sunday, I attended GA and a member from the Demands and Objectives Committee read off a 'preliminary' list of demands. Trouble is, the speaker read it so fast and light was so dark that I could not get it down in writing.
Does anyone reading this forum have the list of demands read last Sunday (Oct 23) at GA?
Demand Committee Meeting Notes Oct. 1, 2011
Submitted by wendel eckford on
The Demands Objectives Committee met today at 1300 hrs, October 1, 2011 on the west side of City Hall. Attendees: Mat, Wendel, Lala, Julia, Eanna, Alyassa, Booker T., Jerry, Doug, Jessica, Arturo, CJ, Richard, et. al. (If I have forgotten someone's name please let me know)
Ground Rules:
Ground rules for future meeting were layed out to ensure that we have an open and democratic process where all ideas are given equal weight and all feel welcome to offer their ideas in a transparent and postive setting. The following ground rules were established:
1. Rotation of Chairperson for each meeting, time keeping, and to respect each others opinions and to keep all discussions poltical and not personal.
2. Meeting duration should be one and a half hours.
3. Meetings will begin at 1730 hrs Mon thru Fri. or as designated by attendees. The meeting location will be on the west side steps of City Hall.
Discussion: It was decided, with unanimous support, that our first discussion should be general in nature to get a sense of the temperature of the attendees and at later meetings the Committee would work toward formulating a more detailed and specific declaration.
Members in attendance agreed their might be some overlap of ideas between all national Occupying Groups (OGs) and coordinating efforts should be established by the appointment of a national committee liason. Wendel Eckford volunteered. A point was raised that although we should show solidarity with all OG's we must develop our demands as they pertain to Los Angeles. It was also agreed that a research team to include Wendel Eckford and Alissa Kokkins will make up a Reaseach sub committe within the Demands Committee. Their goal will be to provide intellectual, politlcal and phiosophical support for the Demands as they are generated.
It was noted that the initial goal by Occupy Wall Street was to go after the corrupton by investement groups on Wall St. However, the Los angeles Demands Committee noted that there are other goals, i.e. nationalizing of banks, and job creation, specifically that should be one of the central demands of Occupy Los Angeles. The creation of employment should include specific job creation for transgender, women, legalization of immigrant workers, and a political move away from both the Republican and Democratic parties.
As a movement we should understand the pwer of ideas/words. Our language needs to be tailored to our communities consciousness to ensure maximum strength of our demands. The committee should explore concrete demands of what people are experiencing in the present, for example home foreclosures. We should work toward attracting working people and demand full employment and for all and for workers to have the right to join a Union.
Our demands must be specific and concreate, i.e. "Double the minimum wage" rather than "get a living wage." The movement should link up with rank and file workers. We as a group undersatnd that the Democratic Party will not break with Unions so we must appeal to workers directly.
Our demands must link the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan with communty oppression. Homelessness must be abolished as everyone should have the right to a home, right to health care and education.
Matt passed out a draft "Proposal For Demand Guidelines." The Committee accepted the draft and discussed the goals of the document. Matt stated that as we are all in agreement with Occupy Wall Street Declaration their message may be too complicated for the people and media. We should simplify the WS Declaration to ensure that our Demands are concise and understandable by the people. At some point it may be appropriate to present indepth policy but not at this particular point. It was noted that our Demands must include the destruction of the ruling oligarchy.
The "Proposal for Demands Guidelines" included the following:
Banking Reform
a. Stronger regulations
b. Enforce Investment Banking Transparency Laws and Guidelines
Tax Reform
a. Consider the Warrent Buffet Tax proposal and ensure wealthy pay their fair share.
b. End Bush Tax Cuts
c. No Offshore jobs without a stiff tax penalty
Campign Finance Reform
a. Repeal the "Citizens United" Supreme Court decision - Corporations are not people.
Economic Policy Reform
a. Stop all Wars
b. End Poverty
c. Keep Social Security Strong
d. Bail out the poor
e. Fund education not the military
f. Keep Unions strong
g. Return TARP funds to the people
Healthcare Reform
a. Public healthcare option and Universal healthcare
b. Healthcare insurance reform
Immigration Reform
a. Commpassionate, fair immigration reform
compiled by Wendel Eckford, Oct. 1, 2011.
"All that is solid melts into Air"
demands
Submitted by jubileenow on
Respectfully, this is too broad. When Paulsen came to congress for the 700 billion he had one sheet of paper. One sheet of paper that spelled disaster for this country. The banks made the rules, they will not keep their own laws. Our government is in bed with the banks. Remember, it was Pelosi and Frank, democrats, who pushed for the bailout. Rebublicans would have never bailed out the banks. We need the 700 billion back; we need forgiveness of the forclosed mortages; and we need forgiveness of outrages credit and school loan debt. And, we need the backs and AIG and Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac to be brought on charges. Period!
jubileenow
No more special treatment
Submitted by dan cooper on
nore more special treatment to corperations and governmental agencies..........
No more retro active immunity from prosucution. no more violations of the Contitution.
If we get them to repeal SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY FROM PROSRCUTION GIVEN TO JUDGES FOR TAKING BRIBES AND ALL THOSE INVOLED IN GIVING THE BRIBES.) THIS SHOULD ROCK THEM TO THE CORE.
HISTORY OF RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY IN THE UNITED STATES
1. given for unconstitutional use of torture
2. given for illegal merger of banks (we can see the effects of that now)
3. given to telecom company for illegal wire taps. (Fisa bill that led to the patriot act)
4. given to Judges for taking bribes. (SBX211)
SBX211 Retro Active Immunity given to California judges for openly taking bribes. Judges are employees of the state they receive their pay and benefits from the state. The Los Angeles Superior court judges are currently receiving an additional $57.688,00 from the county of Los Angeles. there is no bigger user of the court than L.A. County.(A party to the case and has a financial interest in most cases in the courts) Those payments were found to be unconstitutional / illegal in Sturgeon vs Los angeles County. After that decision the judges paid a lobbyist to pass SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY )
SBX211 does not restore due process
SBX211 violates Article 1 section 9 (no ex post facto laws shall be passed )
SBX211 violates the 14th amendment (no equal protections)
SBX211 violate checks and balances between legislative and Judicial powers.
Judges do not disclose the county payments at the onset of any trial where the county is either a party to the case or has a financial interest. (Judges violate Judicial codes of ethics)
Judges refuse to recuse themselves when requested under CCP170
Judges find themselves unbiased and then file an order striking statement.
SBX211 is evidence of conspiracy of the California legislative branch of government to cover up the multiple felony's committed by the Judicial branch of government. By an act of Legislation, California's judicial branch has admitted to be corrupt.
SECTION FROM SBX211
This bill would provide that no governmental entity, or officer or employee of a governmental entity, shall incur any liability or be subject to prosecution or disciplinary action because of benefits provided to a judge under the official action of a governmental entity prior to the effective date of this bill on the ground that those benefits were not authorized under law.
Robert kennedy spoke out against retro active immunity..."QUOTE" (The very idea of "retroactive immunity" ... is so radical, so repugnant to the most basic principles of the "rule of law," that only one prior attempt can be found in recent history (at least from my research): the efforts by some in Congress (in 1965) to enact a law retroactively legalizing the mergers by six large banks which clearly -- as a federal court found -- were illegal under our nation's antitrust laws.
The banks knew when they merged that they were almost certainly violating anti-trust laws. But they did it anyway. And when courts began ruling that their behavior was illegal, they ran to Congress to demand that a law be passed granting them amnesty, claiming that the consequences would be ruinous if they were held accountable under the law. ) But the very concept of retroactive amnesty, the idea that corporations could break the law and then have Congress pass a special law legalizing their lawbreaking conduct, was so profoundly offensive to Sen. Robert Kennedy (who had been the Attorney General when the banks broke the law with their mergers), as well as then-Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach, that they engaged in extraordinary efforts to try to put a stop to this Congressional travesty.
Robert Kennedy was NOT able to stop them at that time in our history. What will happen in the future now that it is legal for judges to take bribes? How could you bring evidence of corruption and violations of the LAW when you have a court that has been granted RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY for taking bribes.
REPEAL SBX211
THIS SHOULD BE A VERY SIMPLE DEMAND FOR EVERYONE TO AGREE WITH.
NO ONE SHOULD BE ABOVE THE LAW. CORPERATIONS AND GOVERNMENTAL AGENCIES SHOULD BE HELD TO THE SAME STANDARDS OF THE LAW AS THE 99% ARE HELD TO THE LAW.
If we don't do this we should all go home and tell our children that we were too chicken s**t and we leave them with a mountain of debt and a corrupt government........
We don't do this, but what we do is the duty given us
Submitted by Jo Terry on
We are to provide a new guard for our future security. This guard has been developed by 99ers from Scandinavian countries. After 200 years of refinements two states adopted this new guard as well as 25 OECD nations. We commission plenipotentiaries with the mandate to carry out indictments of corrupted government personel. We the people commission government agents, politicians to run government to function as intended. We the people commission New Guards as adopted by 39 governments to investigate corruption preventing government to function as intended. These Jason Bourne plenipotentiaries end both corruption and police abuse as they investigate all agencies. They are not chicken. Your thoughts?
Regarding proposed demands.
Submitted by Matt Demands on
Hi guys, I'm posting the full "Proposal for Demands Guidelines" as was mentioned so that we have it here in the full electronic version. See it below. And when Wendel said it was "accepted by the committee" in his post above, I believe he meant "received by the committee"...point of clarification...:-)
Also, Wendel, thanks so much for taking notes at the meeting and posting this so quickly today.
Furthermore, after listening to the many comments and suggestions at today's 1:00 meeting, we are definitely getting closer to some direction on this committee. The ideas presented at the meeting definitely illustrate that this rough draft start proposal below needs a lot of work. Of course, it was only intended as a rough start that we could use as a base.
Also, despite my imploring that we aim for simplicity and "General Demands", I believe that the point made by Quasi and others about our demands becoming quite concrete is very important. If we can say things like, "We demand a doubling of the mimum wage" as opposed to "We demand increased wages" we are presenting no uncertain terms.
Also, there was a great point made about "maximizing our demands". The counter movement is going to want nothing more than to minimize our demnds or even reverse them. We have to start from a position of greatest ideals and potential. Example, "End the wars, NOW!", not "Gradually pull the troops out by 2014".
Quasi also made excellent points about making our demands relevant to the CURRENT expressed demands of the people right now. For example, "We want jobs now", "Stop foreclosures now", "Expanded VA benefits for veterans now", "Stop ICE raids and deportation on immigrants NOW"...etc., etc. He is right that more people will believe in the movement if it addresses the current overwhelming grievance relevant RIGHT NOW.
Also, Ali made a good point about making a version of our demands as advertising-like Slogans that can be easily read and understood by the press and the people. I think that there is room for BOTH the Slogan-like appeal as well as the more concrete demands. The two can co-exist. Some are great on signs, and others are great in formal press releases when the time comes to present our official demads and grievances.
Anyway, below was my original draft proposal, open to scrutiny and critique.
Occupy Los Angeles
A Proposal for Demands Guidelines
(Unofficial, not to be interpreted as an official List of Demands)
Our goal must be to influence policy by our policy makers in office, but also to inspire the people to join a political and cultural movement.
This means we must put our demands in terms that can be clearly understood by our local politicians who serve us, and everyone else.
Our politicians and our media need to hear clear, concise demands that may very well reflect the same, redundant political demands we hear in the news today or when politicians are on the campaign trail. Why? Because our local politicians need to be able to latch on to a communicable platform, with which they can then take to the local, state, or national congressional arenas to enact change. No amount of rage changes the political process. We must hone the rage.
At the same time, we have a message to deliver to the general public. This too must have a clear, concise delivery that informs at a practical level, but also inspires.
Yes, we have a long list of complicated grievances and demands, but we cannot have a long list of rambling grievances and demands that clouds the message for each demand. This proposal implores a plan of action that states a list of “General Demands” which can be broken down into “Specific Demands”. Because each is complicated on its own, the “Specific Demands” can be broken down further via addendums and clarification through official press releases.
Ultimately, these General Demands must be written as a statement that reflects all demands and grievances stated, sort of like the preamble to the Constitution.
We must also make the people, corporations, and politicians aware of the consequences of Demands not being met, and in no uncertain terms.,e.g., ;
“If our demands are not met, we the people will exercise our consumer RIGHT and CIVIC duty to withdraw our money from the banking system and initiate a run on the banks, plunging our nation and the world further into economic disaster, so as to force the issue with our policymakers to listen and act on the demands of the people who really should have the power, we, the other 99%.”
General Demands
(proposed, amend as necessary)
Banking Reform Now
· Stronger Banking Regulations Now!
· Enforce Investment Banking Transparency, Laws, Guidelines
Tax Reform Now
· Tax Reform Now!
· Make the wealth pay their fair share
· End the Bush Tax Cuts
· Consider the Warren Buffett tax proposal
· Close tax loopholes for corporations and the rich
· No offshore jobs without stiff tax penalties
Campaign Finance Reform Now
· Repeal the “Citizens United” Supreme Court decision!
· Corporations are not people!
Economic Policy Reform Now
· Stop the Wars NOW! Bring the money home!
· Protect the poor
· End poverty
· Keep Social Security Strong
· No Profits over People
· Bail out the poor, not the banks
· Return the TARP funds to the people
· Stop the Middle Class squeeze
· Keep Unions Strong: Maintain Collective Bargaining Rights
· Fund schools, not the military
Healthcare Reform Now
· Public healthcare option
· Healthcare for all
· Health insurance reform now
Immigration Reform Now
· We demand compassionate, fair immigration reform
The 1% needs to hear clear concise demands
Submitted by Jo Terry on
We the people are commissioning a New Guard for our future security. This guard has our mandate to deliver the demands of the 99ers. If you fail to run our government as intended this guard will bring you up on indictments.
We are always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption.
Additional Demands thread in the General Forum
Submitted by Matt Demands on
I was thinking that we needed a Demands thread in the General Discussion Forum in ADDITION to this internal Demands Committee forum. Sure enough, someone already created it 3 days ago. This is good. We need a highly accessible Demands solicitation arena. I may even suggest to the moderator of this site to create a Demands thread under the major Forums heading. Apparently there is a moderator who can only do this.
The Demands Committee can hopefully serve as a consolidator of solicited Demands for when it comes time to propose to the General Assembly or to issue official, collective Press Releases.
Additions..
Submitted by Myko on
How bout also:
Public Financing of Elections
Third Party Representation in All Debates
Myko
in that vein...
Submitted by ultrarad on
consider taking back public spectrum:
Restoring the fairness doctrine for broadcast media (i.e. public spectrum.)
Political advertising on broadcast media required to be non-profitable to broadcasters as a condition of licensure, with minimum time alotted and equal access to opposing positions.
Although this may seem to be detail, it's core to taming corporate influence on multiple levels.
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Radical also means staying critical and not drinking anyone's kool-aid.
ONE DEMAND: RESTORE OUR DEMOCRACY BY ENDING CORPORATOCRACY
Submitted by danielbrummel on
Does anyone not understand the basic message, the one basic demand of this protest???
"THE BASIC MESSAGE OF THIS PROTEST IS that Wall Street is oozing corruption and criminality and its unrestrained political power—in the form of crony capitalism and ownership of political institutions—is destroying financial security for everyone else." (Glenn Greenwald)
The corporate monster is an extremely difficult one to address, and we must keep our energy focused in solidarity. If this movement is to be successful, it must stick to its guns on this ONE UMBRELLA DEMAND: RESTORE OUR DEMOCRACY BY ENDING THE CORPORATOCRACY. We must, at all costs, remain in complete solidarity behind this one basic and general demand, and not veer into discussion of other demands that do not fall under this umbrella. If corporate money were taken out of American politics, and the American government were to become what it perhaps once was and what it has always aspired to be -- a participatory, truly representative democracy -- the public would have a renewed opportunity to express themselves through legislature and public policy, and demands of various stripes would be heard and met. But at this crucial turning point in this particular movement, OTHER DEMANDS, WHILE OF COURSE VERY VALID, WILL ONLY UNDERMINE OUR STRENGTH because, by definition, they do not have the support of the 99% who are being financially victimized by the 1%. They are other issues that could begin to be solved once the MONEY IS OUT OF POLITICS. This is the one issue we can and should ALL get behind. In order to continue gaining momentum and growing in numbers, this must remain our one overarching demand.
I move that Occupy Los Angeles adopts and releases the following demand declaration, or something similar, as soon as possible:
***
"DECLARATION OF THE DEMAND: Our one basic demand is an immediate end to the corporate rule over our representative democracy. We will take all patient and deliberate actions necessary to ensure that our one demand is met as soon as possible. We recognize our demand is a general one; it must be so, because it is in response to a endemic problem with multifarious faces. Rest assured that in the coming days, weeks, and years it will be followed by more specific demands with more focused targets. We will vigilantly continue our Occupation of Los Angeles until the crux of our one basic demand is met. We will know that day has come by the shared happiness we will experience as one people, when equal access to resources and the overall equality of wealth have manifested through the demise of the corporate monster."
***
Then, as a demands committee, a general assembly, an occupation of L.A.'s City Hall, and a national movement of occupations, we can move on to discussing more specific actions and demands that help achieve the basic demand.
I write these comments after attending three meetings of the Demands Committee, listening carefully to everyone's inidividual ideas about the movement's demands, and doing more research and coming to understand the nature of what is happening at City Hall in Los Angeles now as it relates to what has happened and continues to happen on Wall Street. Over the last 48 hours in protest mode, my concerns about the demands of "Occupy Los Angeles" and "Occupy Together" in general have grown and changed. We must retain our solidarity on the umbrella demand of the movement so that we can begin to work on strategies to begin to win small battles towards achieving that basic demand. For those who do not understand how the corporatocracy is stealing our money and ruining our lives, education and outreach programs should be set up to show how all problems stem from the larger economic issue of corporate rule."
Please discuss and revise as necessary!!!
Daniel Brummel
¡¡¡ EL PUEBLO UNIDO JAMÁS SERÁ VENCIDO !!!
FIRST THEY IGNORE US, THEN THEY LAUGH AT US, THEN THEY FIGHT US, THEN WE WIN
Some suggestions:
Submitted by ultrarad on
I agree that it's essential to keep it simple and keep it focused. It's also essential to remember that this movement goes nowhere if most people don't feel it strikes a chord with them. However much I might agree with many of the points on any of the laundry-lists I've seen circulating, the question is, how many people NOT occupying could even begin to relate to them. Not so long ago over 50 million within the 99% this movement purports to represent the interests of voted for Bush...which I mention only as a reminder of where much of this country is in terms of opinion and consciousness. The challenge is to engage without compromising core values or aims.
The protests in Israel (the Tentifada, see https://secure.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/wiki/2011_Israeli_social_justi... and note that around 5% OF THE POPULATION PARTICIPATED, which would be equivalent to over 15 million in the U.S.) offer a good model in the sense that their core demand is simple and practical: affordable housing. Everyone can understand it and few can unashamedly oppose it. They are making demands of their political system, but regardless of their sympathies, they are not (yet) siding with any party.
I'd suggest the sentence:
"Rest assured that in the coming days, weeks, and years it will be followed by more specific demands with more focused targets. "
be revised:
"This core demand creates the foundation enabling broad-based action towards practical objectives, directed towards redressing the injustices brought about under corporate rule and building a sustainable, functioning economy centered around human needs. "
which embraces so many of the laundry-list points without assaulting the people we should be trying to win over.
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Radical also means staying critical and not drinking anyone's kool-aid.
ONE DEMAND
Submitted by sarahadina on
I agree with Daniel Brummel - the movement would benefit by agreeing on one main demand. Other issues will inevitably come up, but one basic rallying cry will help galvanize a greater % of this 99% we speak of.
I think what he proposes sums it up well: end corporatocracy, restore democracy.
This movement is based "on
Submitted by danielbrummel on
This movement is based "on issues not of ideology but of economic justice." -- Chris Hedges
¡¡¡ EL PUEBLO UNIDO JAMÁS SERÁ VENCIDO !!!
FIRST THEY IGNORE US, THEN THEY LAUGH AT US, THEN THEY FIGHT US, THEN WE WIN
Example of SIMPLE unified statement
Submitted by kalliope93 on
Hello,
Last night’s general assembly perceived a need for a simple & unified statement to widely and effectively propogate the Occupy message.
There are many more complex issues. This message is consciously brief and simple.
1. War
We are here to express support for the October 6 Freedom Plaza Occupation. After 10 years of continuous war it is time to end U.S. military actions in Iraq, Afghaistan, and Libya. Bring the Troops home now.
2. Banks & Debt Slavery
We are here to express support for Occupy Wall Street. We do not accept the manipulation of our economy by corrupt banks and financial traders. We oppose the manipulation of U.S. and world economies by central banks such as the Federal Reserve and IMF which expand their power by driving a majority of the U.S. and world populations into Debt Slavery.
3. Democracy & Corporatism
We are here in recognition of the fact that our democratic electoral process has become corrupted by corporate and banking interests. The majority of elected officials no longer serve the American people. We seek true democracy free from the manipulation of corporate and bank agendas. We seek government By the People For the People.
4. Non-Violence
We are committed to peace and non-violence. Our strength is through numbers and consensus. We do not use force or aggression to achieve our goals.
This document is offered Open Source with Love for Occupy LA and all Humanity
Simplicity
Submitted by Maurice - Transit TV on
There are obviously many currently existing modes of operation that need adjustment if not outright dismantling. I just read the declaration of occupation by our brothers occupying Wall Street and I am worried that we will become the Democrat's Tea Party. It is my humble opinion that if worry too much about jobs, wars, immigration, environment, poverty, education, etc., and while they are all worthy causes, we will be bouncing from subject to subject with no clear objective giving the current perception of the movement, that the goals are unclear, that much more resource.
In speaking with several individuals attending the GA, at work, with my employees, with my vendors,with my suppliers, , etc. it is clear that it is the bailout where many can agree that a great injustice has been served. I mean even staunch Tea Party members that I have had discussions with agree that the bailout was irresponsible, not logical, backwards, confusing, harrowing to those that lived within their means, harrowing to those that are being foreclosed upon, suffocating to those under the load of student loans, etc.
What do we want?
ONE: All the companies that were bailed out need to come forth now that we are in calmer times and be sold by individual asset to the highest bidder. I want my company, my neighbor's company, my house, my neighbor, my favorite restaurant, my best friend's son, my fellow brothers and sisters in occupation, etc. to be able to buy their financial obligation at auction. The auction needs to be public and give everyone the ability to buy whatever indebtedness controlled by the parties involved to be up for sale to an individual. NO BUNDLING OF ASSETS.
TWO: Give interest expense a geographical boundary. This can be accomplished by passing laws that empower more credit unions to serve local communities. This can be accomplished by forbidding the sale of trust deeds, educational loans, car loans, life insurance, credit card loans, and any other form of financial obligation, to those that have no personal connection to where the debt originated. With the increasing of local power, we may even find ourselves where even insurance companies should be fragmented. I mean if I could buy Sylmar insurance and I get in a fender bender with someone from Sylmar, I am most likely to come to an amicable result, which rarely happens now. Credit unions should be locally owned and not for sale to a party that does not live within the community it serves.
There are no more demands, just two; and if we are able to sound this off over and over with accuracy and intelligence, what an incredible and powerful people's mic that would be.
Embracing unions is an incorrect move. After all, it is not just banks and other companies that would have been decimated if the financial crisis had happened, as it should have. Unions would have been decimated as all unions have members dues tied up in assets that would have had a day of reckoning as well. Pensions and other savings vehicles would have gone to zero and unions would have disappeared in their current form. Obama was served with an opportunity that would rival, and by any means not be a close second to what Lincoln faced in the 1860s, but a second never the less, if he would have forced the carrying out of the laws that already existed and are used for those that cannot meet their financial obligations, yes, chapter 7. The move to have been calculating really would have been "CHANGE" and those opportunities to make social change with one action just do not come that often in history. He failed us because unions have just as much political clout, lobbyists, personal interest, etc. as corporations, and that is probably why he wavered. Well, while the current proposal would not subject the asset destruction as wide spread, as the financial crisis would have, unions could be allies but should remain at an arm distance.
Incidentally, point one could be forced and it would be the greatest move of social peaceful disobedience ever. I will refrain in the offering of how that could be accomplished at this time, but it is simple, effective, and would get attention very quickly.
I leave you with the words of Thomas Jefferson that predicted we would get to this point:
I am not an advocate for frequent changes in laws and constitutions. But laws and institutions must go hand in hand with the progress of the human mind. As that becomes more developed, more enlighten, as new discoveries are made, new truths discovered and manners and opinions change, with the change of circumstances, institutions must advance also to keep pace with the times. We might as well require a man to wear still the coat which fitted him when a boy as civilized society to remain ever under the regimen of their barbarous ancestors.
Here is a suggestion and idea
Submitted by elespiritu on
Here is a suggestion:
1. The General Assembly has posted their minutes. I think the Demand Committe should do the same.
-
Submitted by Myko on
-
Myko
***COMMITTEE AGENDA TEMPLATE***
Submitted by Matt Demands on
Committee Agenda Template
1.
Introduction of facilitators and explanation of their roles (Moderator, Stack Keeper, Timekeeper, Note-taker)
2.
Reminder of hand signals and their meanings
3.
Reading of the minutes from the previous meeting
4.
Updates (GA Assembly meets, Research info, etc.)
5.
Discussion/Debate/Proposals of the topics at hand (items to be included need to be discussed before close of the previous meeting and agenda drafted immediately thereafter)
*Note: Members have asked that most pressing topics be dealt with first.
6.
Wrap the meeting (confirmation of points/updates/proposals/temperature/vote TBD at GA meeting if applicable)
7.
Draft Agenda for next meeting (including identifying facillitator)
*This is the agenda template that we agreed upon and utilized yesterday to keep us informed, on track and productive. If there are no concerns we can continue to use this model. If any arise please bring up in the next meeting.
Demand Tim Geithner [Secretary of the Treasury] be Removed
Submitted by Hardly.Conscious on
He is one of the main culprits.
He still holds one of the most influential positions in this country.
It was clear that Obama wasn't going to force change as soon as he appointed Larry Summers and Tim Geithner to the influential economic positions that they took. Summers is out, Geithner is still in.
Occupy Wall Street & Occupy LA agenda's not close
Submitted by alhs06 on
I need to first Thank all involved in New York for having the balls to Start the original movement.
I also need to thank all those in L.A. who so quickly & magnificently, demonstrated the same set of cahonies by following in kind, here, on the West Coast. RESPECT TO YOU BOTH!
Now, with no Disrespect implied or intended, I will put forth my feeling's & concern's for the List of General Demand's being prepared by us here on the "Best Coast" as compared to the original charter as prepared by our Brother's & Sister's back east on the "Least Coast", I'm kidding you Madison Ave. Maniac's.
The following "Mission Statement" is copied directly from the Occupy Wall Street home page. It is quite a bit different than the "General Demands" being kicked around for us here in L.A.
Occupy Wall Street home page, link: http://occupywallst.org/
Okay, Kaliopie93 started strong in his post
This initial comment reflects the OWS agenda, but quickly disembarks from direction when when the Bring the Troops home general demand is posted. We are now no longer "THE 99%", we have just pissed off the small percentage of those who disagree, probably most from the right, with that demand, we are now "The 85% (+/-)",
Next, Maurice - Transit TV - excludes The Union's,
I know several Union/Trade member's who are 100% behind Occupy, these are Electrician's, Carpenter's, Plumber's, Welder's, ...etc. By your statement, the majority of these guy's would feel singled out & uneasy, the majority would walk. So now "The 99% > 85% will be more like The 65%", see where I'm going with this?
The Brilliance of this movement is the simplicity of it. It has ONE FLAVOR that Everybody likes & can get behind on, But when we start turning it intro a 51 Flavor thing, we will splinter, we will list, we will sink.
I guess it's up to the OLA committee leaders, another partial stray from the "Leaderless OWS" agenda, to decide on our demand's, so remember, you represent The 99% going in with a blank page. What you put on that page will determine The XX% you will now represent going into battle.
Think long and make a wise decision for the Greater Good of us all, please.
Demands or Objectives
Submitted by YogiMi on
David Swanson is bringing the following to DC:
Tax the rich and corporations
End the wars, bring the troops home, cut military spending
Protect the social safety net, strengthen Social Security and improved Medicare for all
End corporate welfare for oil companies and other big business interests
Transition to a clean energy economy, reverse environmental degradation
Protect worker rights including collective bargaining, create jobs and raise wages
Get money out of politics
It's too much on the plate
Submitted by alhs06 on
I say this with all respect, but how are most of those issues going to help the 99%. All we are doing is addressing too many issues that will shatter our Unique Solidarity, that includes all parties, races, genders religions & most importantly, those who have for the first time in their lives, got up & off the couch to participate in a possible Historical event.
We will receive a label from the overly redundant reporting news networks by the end of the weekend, as well as several people dissecting the topics being brought up by Swanson to try & find some idiotic Secret Social Agenda held by Occupy.
All I and anyone else who understands & agrees with my ranting (apologies) can do now is Hope for the Best & Prepare for the worst.
Turn out The Light's The Party's ...... :(
Attacking the real problem
Submitted by BFranklin on
1. End the Federal Reserve. It needs to go. This means Congress and the President order a resolution to dissolve the Federal Reserve. They're one of the prime instigators in this entire mess.
2. Congress passes a resolution to fix all real estate land values and write off all defaulted home loans and student loans. $20,000 an acre for residential, $80,000/acre for commercial. Home values will be based entirely off the condition of the house, and the materials used to build it (and the fixed cost of the land with 20% sales tax).
3. Single Payer Healthcare. Federal, of course.
4. End the IRS and institute 20% federal sales tax. No more payroll tax. Eliminate all other taxes. No one gets past with loopholes (eg corporate write-offs). Estates, investments, savings and capital gains are not touched. The public coffers will overflow.
5. Gut out the racist/classist DEA, ATF, and all other crony buraeucracies. Dissolve them. They waste money and resources, and accomplish nothing productive (they make the problems worse). Leave substance regulation to the states.
6. Immediately repeal the Patriot Act.
7. Regulate the Federal Government. Any money a public official receives that is not part of his salary will be met with Federal Prison sentence. No more special interest lobbying to politicians, period.
8. A new legislative system that requires politicians to obtain consent from their constituency (by vote) before petitioning bills to congress (both senate and house). Lobby organizations can only lobby the populace for votes. If a lobby organization presents a media campaign to the public, it must be counterbalanced with the opposite view from an opposing organization to ensure fair and free information is being propogated to the masses. No longer can politicians be bribed... they MUST obtain voter approval before submitting bills.
9. Publicly financed campaigns with equal airtime. Prospective office holders must pass vigorous background checks including all business associations and a deep probe into their personal lives (character and integrity). They must also have fully-formed bill proposals ready, a planned agenda, and full approval of a citizen's investigative commitee.
10. Require that corporations be 60% employee-owned with only a 40% margin for free trade on the market. Employee shares are equally distributed by each employee, and employees are actively involved in decision-making meetings.
11. Insititute equlization of trade through fair trade tarriffs. Price foreign-made goods at a comparable price to a domestically-made counterpart. Force corporations to bring manufacturing and jobs back to America, and to stop enslaving third-world countries.
12. End all foreign wars. Authorize domestic oil drilling again so we can become energy self-sufficient and end reliance on OPEC. Federal fianancing into alternative energy sources so that we can move forward from oil quickly.
13. Ban imminent domain.
14. Part-time legislature in congress. Congress convenes only twice a year (Spring, Fall) for two weeks at a time. Only the office of the President is year-round, with all other government agencies.
15. End all corporate subsidies. No more corporate welfare, ever.
Time for a new government.
Excellent starter list of financial reform
Submitted by Kate89 on
I absolutely agree that the Federal Reserve must be eliminated, because this unelected body of private (and secretive) bankers somehow get the authority to control the money and credit supply, in such a way that benefit themselves and their elite associations.
So I think the first objectives of the Occupy movement should be to educate and be educated about the role of money/credit supply in all levels of economic conditions.
Concomitant with financial/economic reforms should be government reform that completely removes money/lobbying/bribery from the political process. Instead, the political process should be based on rational process and empirical data.
Other reforms such as healthcare or education can be debated later, once more people involved in the reformation process become more educated in the role of government intervention and the good and bad consequences. For example, true free market (little to no government intervention, let market derive true costs to public) versus socialist system (high government intervention thru high taxation to guarrantee free healthcare or education, with potential abuses always).
I personally think it is premature to demand a minimum wage (especially an absolute value that can be meaningless in high inflation) and free education or healthcare when we don't know how much that would really cost in terms of taxes.
The United Cities of America
Submitted by FrancesYasmeen on
This is an idea that I've had for a while, that might have some legs... and I'd like to know what other people think of it.
Basically, my proposal is that we get rid of States altogether and force a more sensible localization of power - to the city level.
Right now, states are responsible for governing very diverse populations living in very different environments, with very different needs. Cities are struggling to make ends meet and sustain their communities even as the pool of federal and state dollars is sucked up into war spending and funding federal attempts at fixing what's broken, and being spread too thin throughout states.
It's been encouraging to see the LA City Council support Occupy LA, and previously to see mayors around the country speaking out for a real end to the war in Afghanistan. The people who are actually responsible for governing - not just legislating - seem to have a better pulse on the needs of the people.
City leaders would be in charge of governing, all taxes would be paid to one's city. Perhaps each city would then pass on some tax dollars to the federal government, which might still be in charge of foreign affairs and national security. And, since cities controlled the purse, there'd be more oversight and control over how we let our federal government do those tasks.
We could create a new governing body with one representative from each city, town, municipality, etc. Elections would be localized and thus potential be less prone to fraud. Judicial responsibilities would also stay local, and communities would be more responsible for dealing with their own people's behavior. Community would be stressed. People could take pride in their city, and what they actually contribute to it - not just have some detatched jingoistic nationalism.
That's the basic idea, lots of room to run with it. It would be an interesting and maybe feasible way to restructure the system and remove current power structures without completely removing a working civil society.
Thoughts?
-Frances Yasmeen
One Problem: Money Three Areas of Action: Politics/Courts/Media
Submitted by Fallout2man on
I've said this several times before. But we NEED to identify the root of the problem. Yes we are all protesting Wall St. greed, we're protesting how the financial sector bought and paid for preferential treatment and bribed its way out of accountability.
But what does that mean? The system failed us! but how did it fail? Simple, there is one problem: Money!
Money is an inherently coercive force, it's the grease that keeps our economy and lives going but at the same time money and pursuit of money must be seen as what it is, inherently a tainted pursuit. That however DOES NOT mean I am anti-capitalist or advocating any radical alternative to our current system. But what I am advocating is this, we must remove the ability of money to influence our institutions of power.
To that end I have analyzed how we got here, how we were sold out and became stooges to the entire corporate world.
1: Money in Politics (How the laws get written)
1a: Mandatory public financing for ALL elections
Why: If money determines one's ability to be elected, one is naturally beholden to those with money, which is an abdication of an elected official's patriotic/official duty.
1b: Ban soft money
why: Issue ads are a way to launder money and peddle influence deceptively. Issue ads should only be allowed for ballot initiatives, be publicly financed or outright banned. One's voice in politics must NOT be determined by the size of their wallet. This is a primary way to silence good ideas and subvert democracy.
1c: Declare elections day every two years a national holiday and make voting compulsory.
why: We cannot consider our republic to truly represent the will of the people if half of the nation does not vote.
1d: Some form of proportional representation and instant runoff voting for ALL elections.
why: We must break the two-party system to be free from this tyranny. Even if it is not necessarily a direct cause of our current situation its continued existence greatly enables it and its removal would do wonders to further our democracy. We need to lower the barriers to entry in politics so that people can gain legitimacy and the public can express finely nuanced support for who they want in power.
This lets the best ideas win and the best candidates get elected. We must reject party ID, the big two cannot represent America.
2: Money in the Courts (How the law gets enforced and how people are able to pursue claims under it.
2a: Expand and improve the public defender program for civil cases.
why: One of the ways that companies have subverted our essential freedoms is through manipulation of the civil court system. One's ability to pursue a valid legal claim is entirely dependent on their ability to finance a legal team. I REJECT the idea that JUSTICE should EVER be determined by money. Every time a person appears before the court we must provide them with equal legal representation to their counterpart.
It is only through having a fair and equal ability to pursue a claim under the law that justice can be served.
2b: Damage Caps against individuals and families.
Why: We need tort reform! Not for big business but for families! Did you know the RIAA can sue you for up to $150,000 per file downloaded from your machine? They then use the fact that with little evidence they have the ability to reach for a damage award that works out into the billions of dollars if they so choose.
They use this threat to force families who have no money to defend themselves to settle out of court and it only hurts everyone involved. Court awards are meant to be consumerate to actual harm done. We've used statutory damages in many cases as an excuse for a business being unable to tell us how much they were really harmed and now families are suffering.
2c: Bankruptcy reform
Why: Going with the above we must make it easier for individuals to escape onerous debt. Many bankruptcy reforms passed recently have reversed this trend. Making it easier for the wealthy to escape their debts but not those most vulnerable. We must ensure that no human is ever forced into generational poverty or debt slavery by big business. Especially when considering the ridiculous litigation that can be brought against families.
3: Money in the Media (How, as gatekeepers of our national discourse the media can manipulate and directly shape public opinion.)
Preface: This area is most contentious. But we MUST reform the media. While a private enterprise we must understand again, that the objectives of journalism, insightful, hard-hitting reporting that shakes people up, is at odds with the for-profit motives of a business. Thus I advance we must consider News and journalism a public good. It's utility is vital to a functional democracy and we cannot deny that the media whether or not it did so knowingly did not set off warning bells sooner and is by and large doing more to protect corporate interests then to foster insightful dialog in the people.
3a: Clear Media Labeling
why: One of the first ways media has gotten around lying and misleading us is to blur the line between News and entertainment. We allow people to drink and smoke tobacco, but we clearly label each for the harm it does to our bodies. As such I advance that we must clearly label "entertainment news" versus actual journalism, for the irreparable harm so-called "entertainment news" can do to one's mind and perspective.
If someone wishes to push an agenda it is their first amendment right to speak about it. However no person should ever be allowed to institutionalize deceit in the pursuit of their agenda. If they want to lie then it is their right, but it is within our rights to declare that anyone wishing to do so cannot legitimately claim they are their to inform and educate.
We must label all "entertainment news" clearly and prominently wherever it appears, and clearly label all honest journalism where it appears.
3b: Bring Back the fairness doctrine.
why: The second danger in the media is how it can practice viewpoint discrimination and shape public opinion by presenting dishonesty and rhetoric as honest debate. People parroting talking points are considered "experts" and never questioned on their credentials. We must not allow people to create their own "media fiefdoms" where they dehumanize their opponents. This does not serve any legitimate public interest and as history has now shown it fosters a real danger in forwarding eliminationist rhetoric as valid.
All journalistic news must be considered a good to serve the public interest, and an honest debate of ideas always does that. Business will tell you this is discrimination and that it is restricting their free speech rights. But think about that for a second, what is it they're saying they want to do?
They want to use their "free speech rights" to deny another person's ability to speak in defense of themselves so that the business can proceed to lie, call them names and tell people how they 'ought to be shot in the head. Since when does freedom of speech mean freedom to capture an audience and then preach they should violently overthrow those you dislike?
Again, it is one thing for a person to do this. It is another for any business that wishes to be legitimately journalistic. These are not restricting the rights of the people, only the rights of companies to divide and conquer the people.
3c: Empower the FCC to investigate and fine news organizations if they are proven to be intentionally lying, misleading or otherwise pushing an agenda.
why: We empower the FCC to do many things and it does them well. Despite its mandate to protect children from ever knowing the human body exists it does not somehow drown under complaints.
As news organizations have a duty to inform the republic we must create mechanisms for the public to bring legitimate grievances against news companies. We must provide avenues to ensure, just as we do with every other institution of power, that they might be checked in their excess should other checks fail.
3d: Mandatory disclaimer or source reporting for all articles of news.
Why: Another critical avenue to detect faulty journalism is in evaluating one's source of information. We must know when someone is basing their pieces on their own opinion, on research, on interviews, etc. For simple interviews listing a first and last name of the interviewed is fine.
That said it is also crucial that we enable whistleblowers and others to provide anonymous information to the press. As such I forward also that any time an anonymous source or whistelblower is used for an article of news we simply put a disclaimer on the piece and then list that of course an "Anonymous" source contributed to the article.
All of these proposals are non-partisan, all attack our core problem, money and greed have taken complete control of our country's power structure. Democrat, Republican, Libertarian, Independent, whatever you are, YOU believe in a prosperous America. YOU believe in freedom, liberty and justice and YOU know what's wrong and that we haven't been doing what we should to fix it.
So rather than get into an argument about ideology, or where we might have legitimate differences, I speak to you all in solidarity that we as a whole must take back our country. This is how, we must remove the ways they usurped our ability to stay informed and elect who WE THE PEOPLE wish to elect, and not who makes the most backroom deals during the elections cycle.
Strategy suggestions
Submitted by JoviMan on
What you guys are doing is impressive and exciting! Onwards!
Respectfully, my suggestions are (and please forgive any redundancy or if you guys are already implementing these):
- Study the history of successful social movements from around the world. Also read ongoing advice to the Occupy movement by social movement experts as quoted in the media.
- Coordinate with New York on the list of demands. NYC should be calling the shots. This will facilitate organization and efficiency.
- The demand list should be brief and focus on campaign finance reform. I like Daniel Brummel’s “Get Money Out of Politics”. I also think Fallout2man has nailed it on the head: the source of all our problems is the unfair influence of the 1% via money. This is where the message and demand list must focus! (Fallout2man, didn’t you have prior posts? I just saw your 5:16pm post but where did your others go?)
- Once the message and demands are clear and public, once the organization and outreach is effective and streamlined, it’s necessary to show a sign of force: select one day where you ask everyone to call in sick, take a vacation day, do what you must to show up for one day only, especially if you’re unemployed! Truly Occupy LA. Such a show of force will send a clear message to the 1%: the 99% can mobilize when called. Ideally, this should be done on a nationwide scale. This will also build momentum and bring more people into the fold who are sitting on the fence/in their cubicle. Such a show of strength and organization is crucial if this movement is to survive.
Comprehensive Lobbying Industry Reform
Submitted by EndSpiele45 on
Comprehensive Lobbying Industry Reform is needed to insure transparency within our Government
While lobbying could have a positive effect on Government because it provides knowledge in a particular sector of an industry, it can also be perceived as way to bribe Elected Officials, its influence can have a negative or unintended consequence on the way Legislation is written or how Contracts are awarded to benefit a particular industry. The idea is to limit monetary contributions to minimize the influence and to put restrictions on Government Officials and the Lobbying Industry and the so-called Revolving Door. For example in 2010 Federal Officials accepted over $3.5 billion in contributions, while the number of registered lobbyist decreased the contributions actually increased. This site offers a tremendous amount of research and detail data that can be broken down by Industry or Firm contributing that money and who specifically received it, or what bill exactly it was trying to influence!
http://www.opensecrets.org/lobby/index.php
In addition to campaign contributions to elected officials and candidates, companies, labor unions, and other organizations spend billions of dollars each year to lobby Congress and federal agencies. Some special interests retain lobbying firms, many of them located along Washington's legendary K Street; others have lobbyists working in-house.
Although the influence powerhouses that line Washington's K Street are just a few miles from the U.S. Capitol building, the most direct path between the two doesn't necessarily involve public transportation. Instead, it's through a door—a revolving door that shuffles former federal employees into jobs as lobbyists, consultants and strategists just as the door pulls former hired guns into government careers. While officials in the executive branch, Congress and senior congressional staffers spin in and out of the private and public sectors, so too does privilege, power, access and, of course, money.
The most disturbing fact is the Chamber of Commerce practices and influence on Govenment using non-profit Organizations like ALEC American Legislative Exchange Council to draft Legislation that in turn is secretly voted on by Elected Officials and CEOs of multinational Corporations to push their Conservative Agenda from a variety of issues that range from Environmental or Financial deregulation to limiting Voter Rights, etc. A concerted effort to undermine True Democracy at work. Approximately 1000 bills a year are introduced and over 25% become Law.
Here is a link with detailed State by State information on Legislation drafted by ALEC, the Corporations and the Elected Officials affiliated to them.
http://alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_Exposed
Direct Action Against Tax Holiday on offshore corp. profits
Submitted by bdop4 on
Hi Everyone,
I will be at OccupyLA this weekend and would like to discuss the possibility of mounting a direct political action to shut down proposed House and Senate bills that propose to give multinational corporation a tax giveaway on offshore profits. I am still in the research phase of this effort and am working toward preparing a action proposal to be presented in the near future at a general assembly.
This bill, which effectively is a needless tax giveaway to the most powerful multinational corporations, constitutes legalized theft and exemplifies the corrupt practices that brought the Occupy movement into existence.
These bills have some support in both parties, with the only area of disagreement focusing on how the reduced tax revenues would be spent. What I would like to achieve with this action is to develop and incorporate an opposition strategy (i.e., legislative outreach, oped opinions, thematic inclusion in protests, etc.) as part of the Occupy movement against unfettered corporate control of this country. Occupy has shown the world that it has a voice. I want to show the corporate elites that we have teeth as well.
For those interested, here are links to some recent articles and studies:
Bloomberg article dated 10/6/11: http://mobile.bloomberg.com/news/2011-10-06/repatriation-bill-would-tax-offshore-profits-at-8-75-percent?category=%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2F
Study dated 6/23/11 produced by the Center on Budget Policy and Priorities: http://www.cbpp.org/files/4-8-11tax.pdf
These two sources should give people a good picture of what's happening on this issue.
Look forward to talking to somebody this weekend.
Sincerely,
Robert Perry (a.k.a. bdop4)
P.S., here's the text of the Bloomberg article:
Corporate repatriation legislation proposed by Senators Kay Hagan and John McCain would let U.S. businesses bring home offshore profits at an 8.75 percent tax rate.
The rate on repatriated profits would drop to 5.25 percent if a company’s payroll expanded during 2012, according to a summary of the bill released by Hagan’s office. The current top corporate rate is 35 percent.
To qualify for the lowest tax rate, a company would have to increase its payroll by 10 percent as measured by additional workers or higher employee pay.
“I want to use every tool in the toolbox that’s at our disposal to help our economy and put people back to work,” Hagan, a Democrat from North Carolina, said in an interview on Bloomberg Television today.
One of Hagan’s corporate constituents, Charlotte, North Carolina-based Duke Energy Corp. (DUK), is a member of the WIN America Coalition, a group of multinational companies lobbying for a tax holiday on as much as $1.4 trillion in offshore profits.
WIN America campaign manager Karen Olick called the Hagan- McCain proposal “a critical step forward in the effort to jump- start our economic recovery.”
The Win America group supports the Hagan-McCain initiative and a House measure sponsored by Representative Kevin Brady, a Texas Republican, coalition spokeswoman Abigail Gardner said in a telephone interview.
Brady and House Majority Leader Eric Cantor, a Virginia Republican, issued statements praising the Hagan-McCain bill.
Cantor said the measure was “the latest evidence of bipartisan support for repatriation and I applaud their effort.”
“I hope that Congress can act quickly so that the president can sign repatriation legislation that will take effect this fall,” Brady said in a statement.
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid said yesterday that the proposal from McCain, an Arizona Republican, and Hagan won’t pass the Senate as a stand-alone bill and must be coupled with infrastructure improvement provisions.
“It won’t just be simply repatriation,” the Nevada Democrat said. Corporate tax holiday legislation “will be part of an infrastructure program,” Reid said in an interview. He declined to provide details.
2004 Tax Holiday
Independent studies showed that when a tax holiday was last offered, in 2004, the lower tax rate for returning profits spurred little hiring or domestic investment. Most of the money was used to buy back stock. Democrats have said they are concerned that could happen again with a tax holiday.
Under the Hagan-McCain proposal, if a company repatriates profits and then reduces its staff, it would be required to add $75,000 to its gross income for every position eliminated.
That differs from Brady’s legislation, which would require a company to increase its taxable income by $25,000 for every position cut. Brady’s bill would allow companies one year to repatriate offshore profits at a tax rate of 5.25 percent.
The congressional Joint Committee on Taxation has estimated that a tax holiday would cost the Treasury $78.8 billion in forgone revenue over 10 years if the money was brought back to the U.S. at a tax rate of 5.25 percent. [This estimate is low IMO].
Tax attorney H. David Rosenbloom said that adding to a company’s gross income, as the Hagan-McCain proposal does, may be friendlier to business than adding to its taxable income because it provides more chances to whittle down a tax liability through the use of deductions and credits.
“Generally, the higher up on a tax form the number appears, the more opportunities there are, the more things that can occur, said Rosenbloom, a partner at Washington-based Caplin & Drysdale Chartered and director of the international tax program at New York University’s law school.
Rosenbloom said lawmakers were embarrassed following the 2004 repatriation when some companies that participated in the tax holiday eliminated jobs.
‘‘This is basically to keep Congress from getting caught red-faced again,’’ said Rosenbloom.
Chuck Marr, director of federal tax policy at the Washington-based Center on Budget and Policy Priorities, which advocates for low-income people, said the Hagan-McCain proposal contains no incentives to create jobs.
‘‘The lower rate strikes me as a fig leaf,’’ Marr said. At 8.75 percent, companies ‘‘are getting a very low rate with no strings. It’s a 75 percent discount.’’
Infrastructure Bank
Senator Charles Schumer of New York, the chamber’s No. 3 Democrat, said in June that Senate Democrats might be open to using the short-term revenue provided by a corporate tax holiday to finance an infrastructure bank.
Using proceeds of a tax holiday to pay for infrastructure projects would mark a difference between Senate Democrats and the Obama administration. The administration has said it won’t consider repatriation outside of a broader tax-code overhaul.
A coalition of businesses, including United Parcel Service Inc. (UPS) and Boeing Co. (BA), which are lobbying Congress for a lower corporate tax rate, did not comment directly on the Hagan-McCain proposal.
‘‘We view the repatriation issue as something that should be considered within the context of a comprehensive reform of the corporate tax system,” Jim Pinkerton, co-leader of the RATE Coalition, said in a statement.
Two other measures that address repatriation are pending in Congress. Legislation proposed by Representative Shelley Berkley, a Nevada Democrat, would let companies bring home offshore profits at a 25 percent tax rate, and lower if they increase their payrolls.
Senator Mike Lee, a Utah Republican, has proposed an amendment to a currency bill now being considered that would lower the tax rate for returning profits to the U.S.
bdop4
Why Money is the Problem.
Submitted by Fallout2man on
I've posted here before but then most of the forums stopped appearing on the site. I've been refining my points as I talk to people so you'll find various revisions of the same over various comment boards on OWS for news media sites. But my larger goal is to help the movement by honing messaging and ideas to a razor's edge. So I want to talk and engage as many people as possible, debate and do my best to find good ideas and speak for them every chance I get. Secondary to that is work on messaging and sort of honing the tenor of any official demands or goals. We must remember, good politics is inseparable from good policy. The best plan in the world is useless if no one will vote for it.
We know what works, we know what we need to do, maybe not individually but as a whole, and do you know why? America is SMART, it just doesn't always apply its full potential. The process though gets short-circuited when petulant children attempt to manipulate human nature away from pragmatism in government. Suddenly honest debate becomes impossible because you have parties not advocating that they must tackle a practical problem or solution, at this point you just have parties arguing so they don't win or lose elections.
Every time I'd see an idea that made sense die, it died not because of legitimate objections in the congress, it died because people just did or did not want to vote for something. There's another reason we elect representatives. It's because we don't want to have to do all of the math ourselves and do the really HARD work at figuring out ideal policy and balancing concerns. We elect people specifically to do this hard work, but long ago as a society we lost track of something.
People aren't always rational, people aren't always going to make the best choices, and you can't force anyone to make a choice. But what you CAN do, is you can empower everyone with the facts and you can empower them with debate and inclusion to air their grievances. If done right then the side who has created the strongest case should prevail and obviously any legitimate minority concerns should be addressed. And after that? Well, kids will be kids. If someone insists on being a goose they aren't going to stop whatever you do. We must understand that absolutely any society will have professional malcontents whose aim is only the pursuit of institutional power to further their own personal greed and whose tool is a cunning wit and intelligence. It is beyond our ability as a species to truly know another's intent. But it is not beyond our ability to judge the effects of their actions when they reveal to us in advance their plans.
Here are some key principles I'm trying to refine/convey regarding I guess my grander ideas regarding government and the good/bad of the current system. I'm probably going to revise it more, but everyone, please if you have comments or ideas respond. I'm sure we can make a truly excellent proposal together. So right now consider the below my "CURRENT" interpretation of how things are and how they went wrong with a bit of possible solution fit in. Not so much a list of demands in this case but rather what I would hope to be possibly the start of a new attitude and philosophy in general towards government and governing.
Principle Concepts
1: Governing IS PRAGMATISM
Any vote without a clear and reasonable justification (which should be recorded for posterity's sake) should be considered an act of contempt against the American people. And any politician who consistently votes not on the facts, not on informed and well-researched studies that show what the potential effects, ups and downs of a policy are, and instead chooses to vote entirely on ideology, emotions or other nonsense should be given a swift boot from office.
The best remedy I can see for this is to adjust the barriers for entry into politics so that one's ability to get into office rests soley on their ability to sell their ability to empathize with our problems, identify them, and efficiently solve them and to be an effective advocate of their solution.
Right now a lot of paralysis is happening because of three sources
A: People think their vote doesn't matter (often because no elected official represents their more nuanced positions)
B: People vote for the "lesser of two evils" instead of who they really believe in because of party politics,
C: Because of the above two it serves to destroy the ability for politics to change at anything other than a glacial pace. Essentially politicians aren't even jockeying for the hearts and minds of voters anymore. They're jockeying to increase election turnout. Each year the Democrats hope more people vote and the Republicans hope more people stay home. Their actual support bases never change, only elections numbers change. What few good politicians do get elected slowly find themselves burried under the weight of those who wish to do nothing other then play electoral games.
That to me suggests that people are not being given an ability to make their voice heard in politics. We need to allow new people or parties to appear when there is an urgent need. But most importantly we must divorce "party" from "power" in politics.
A politician should be elected on their capacity to solve objective problems and advocate those solutions effectively, NOT which party they belong to, not because they can out fund raise their opponent. They should be elected because they've done their duty and they know about real problems Americans face, they've got the facts and they've got a solution. Parties should only exist to provide an ability for those with like minded ideas to organize and effectively research, debate and hash out policy.
They should not decide who gets to run, they should not influence who gets to run, they should not decide who sits on what committee. Indeed, Washington himself warned us of the danger of parties. There is also however another danger we must also remember, we elect representatives also because they will be willing to do the hard work and research on ideal policy. That also means that the other half of that is when they find an ideal policy that may not have public support but they know is ideal it is their duty to educate and inform us on why we should also believe it's ideal.
What defines Tyranny is not an arbitrary threshold of pain and suffering, but rather when a choice is unnecessarily forced. Therefore a majority may not be tyrannical if a minority cannot make a sound, logical case for why the choice made was unnecessarily forced upon them.
2: Government must be INCLUSIVE
All must be given fair, just and most of all EQUAL treatment under the eyes of the law. We must understand then that money works against this. Those institutions within which we divest power must put this duty before all else. Once you are elected, whatever sort of a person you were before, you are NOW GOVERNMENT and you must discard any part of your past, present, future or person which would in any way impede that duty. There are other areas I'd like to tackle such as lobbying reform but I'm not entirely versed on the laws and policies related to lobbying yet. I may add it as a subsection, it is for exactly that reason that we must reject identity politics.
A person's identity should never disqualify them from holding office. But if a person is beholden to THEIR identity and not to THEIR DUTY, then they are committing an offense so supreme it should almost be criminal. Fortunately we can prevent this simply by embracing a policy of all-inclusivess: And any person or group which centers their IDENTITY around denying or disenfranchising another group should not be given any ability to enforce that belief in practice in their capacity of an elected office. We must SHUN at every instance those who would insist that their freedoms are abridged when they are not allowed the "Freedom" to make use of government office to enforce their own private animus whether towards an individual or group of any kind.
3: Money IS coercion.
Legal tender in all forms is coercion, it is unique in that this is an unavoidable byproduct of money's purpose. Legal tender enables society and commerce but we MUST remember what those things are. They compel someone to perform an act for someone else. It's a mutual agreement but it is still a DEMAND. Money enables us to command others to do as we wish, not in every case or every form but it enables us to form power relationships with one another to achieve specific means.
So money becomes a natural power relationship. It is the grease that enables us to pursue our dreams by soliciting compliance. So the act of giving money to a person is therefore always an act of control because it will always universally ease the effort one needs to expend in controlling others. It creates a connection within our minds and it creates sources and structures of dependence and necessity. So collusion of money is also collusion of power. And what happens when power colludes? Dictatorships, regimes, horrible things that just shouldn't happen.
This doesn't mean money is always bad for us, or a universal evil that need be expunged. For certainly we can see how society has developed both for better and worse under its reign. Which brings me to my next point:
4: CAPITALISM within reason
Capitalism is all about enabling the ideal flow of goods, services and power amongst the people and institutions of the day. It was rooted in certain enlightenment ideas about people and human nature that we know were partly true and partly not.
Capitalism is not a tautology though! We use it because it works, and when it does not work we revise it! Thus we must understand that consumerism is also not inherently moral either. It is not universally good but not bad either. When is harm done? When it is unnecessarily inefficient. Just as I spoke earlier about the pursuit of money being an inherently tainted one, capitalism is a means to an end, and should NEVER be the end itself. We believe in capitalism because we believe that a market economy is a good way to get certain tasks done.
For as much as we know there is still so much more we do not. We as a people wish to naturally pursue certain ends and as a collective society of Americans we wish to pursue these ends together. Thus the duty of both the government and the market is to be the means to achieve these ends as efficiently as possible.
Thus we must always put a fine toothed come to BOTH to ensure that they are doing their jobs. The private sector is not a tautology, the invisible hand of the free market is not an omnipotent, omniscient being which will guarantee optimal prices. Why is this? Because one of the most fundamental principles of any functioning market is the ability of consumers to obtain all information needed to make their purchasing decision and understand it.
Unless all humans are omniscient this is simply impossible in some cases. Therefore we must understand that certain needs or goods which provide immense benefits are not always ones a person is capable of making an informed decision about. Key point: Pharma companies, why do we allow them to advertise directly to consumers? A consumer has not gone through medical school, a consumer does not know medicine, and they do not know how to gauge whether or not a product has truly succeeded or failed.
You know who will? Their Doctor! So why do we allow this? Does this serve anyone's freedom? We must REMEMBER, the private sector can over-reach just as much as the government into our lives. When is there over-reach of either? The moment a case can be made that a choice was unnecessarily forced by either. Look at what Mastercard and others did to wikileaks. Private businesses decided to unilaterally refuse service and because these PRIVATE COMPANIES control so much of what we use to conduct 21st century commerce they effectively removed an entire organization's ability to function and for no other reason than "Just because we wanted to!" Does this mean that we should enact drastic changes to contract law or nationalize the credit card companies? No not necessarily that at all. But what we MUST HAVE are mechanisms by which society at large may enforce consequences against bad actors in the private sector.
Voting with one's dollars is all but a myth, thanks to globalization, technology and many other changes we have centralized business to such a point that it diverts power in few individuals to make sweeping choices over all sectors of the world. Could we just boycott Visa, Mastercard, Discover, Amex and Paypal? No! we'd be just as cut off as wikileaks was, and that's the point. No rational human being will give up their ability to be paid or pay others just because of wikileaks. Does it in any way lessen the supreme wrong done? No, but it does underscore the point. Government provides us a mechanism to remove malefactors from its places of power, business does not provide a comparable alternative. Are we to starve and choke the gutters with the dead every time we wish to remove them from the private sector?
Finally
5: Liberty is choice, it is good because it empowers us to be happy, and for choice to be empowering it must be MEANINGFUL
A lot of the doublespeak we get from our current politicians is filled with poisonous disingenuity with regards towards liberty. Liberty is at its core, the ability for each individual to pursue their happiness, a guarantee to every American by the constitution. As such though liberty is defined by being given a choice or set of choices rather then being compelled to take only one path.
But merely being given a choice is not enough if those choices are meaningless. For WHOSE LIBERTY do you advocate? For WHAT AIM do you desire freedom to accomplish? HOW does the presence of this choice enable greater happiness than would be there if it were not? Is my choice to use an inefficient incandescent light bulb so I can save $0.10 per bulb when for that extra $0.10 my bulb will last ten times as long and I will be 25% more likely to still have an earth to enjoy in my golden years?
Such choices are absolutely meaningless because they have in effect already been made for us. Being offered a choice of "Heads I win, tails you lose" is not freedom, it is the ghost of freedoms robbed from you. Should an individual be able to use incandescent light bulbs they have? Absolutely! that choice enables them to find meaning and value without cost, should we allow individuals to MAKE incandescent light bulbs? If it can be done without causing great harm I see no reason why not. Should we allow businesses to continue manufacturing incandescent light bulbs en masse? Only if it could be said that a public need were reasonably being serviced in a way not otherwise achievable. If the choice is between saving ten cents or getting extra efficiency plus saving the environment then that choice does not serve any purpose except to act as a weapon of mass distraction by politicians wishing to steal your true freedoms out from underneath you.
For indeed it is often these same politicians who have divided us and separated us by manipulating sentiment, by manipulating identity. They have balkanized the American people to maintain their power. But while sunlight is an excellent disinfectant I would also put forth that an even greater one is: The Question. How do you know if a politician is lying or misleading you? When they do not have a completely valid case of facts behind their decisions in office. It is not that they use sound bytes or dodge questions, this is merely a symptom they use to cover the fact that they have made a decision not in the true interests of the American people. If they cannot articulate that to you when asked they are either a failure as a politician for improperly doing their job at advocacy or are a failure of a human being for purposefully abdicating their duty to ensure all decisions made in office are sound.
Now, happiness is a very nebulous and personal concept. So exceptional care must be made with regards to limiting the ability of individuals to pursue their own forms of bliss. We must be inclusive without alienation, but we must be wary of ANY who refuse to include themselves unless we meet demands of alienation or tyranny. If I cannot be happy if my neighbor's mailbox is blue and not red is it my right to demand to the city he change it? No, for what is guaranteed is the pursuit of happiness, and not the conclusion. All demands are not reasonable and while it should be my right to pursue him in changing it, it is NOT my right to enforce it. It is NOT within my rights of free speech to harass him, spread damaging lies about him, or insist that he is spreading a "Blue Agenda" and then to petition government that they must immediately recognize my freedoms by requiring he change his mailbox. It is NOT within my rights to demand that the government increase his taxes or DECREASE its service to my neighbor because I refuse to allow "My taxes" to fund his "Blue agenda."
The question that never gets asked is why this choice has any real meaning? Why is it so important he change his mailbox? What is it that I seek to achieve by doing this? If I simply cannot stand blue mailboxes it is obviously I who 'ought change and not my neighbor. If I am merely offended by the color blue then that choice is meaningless. Offense may be taken for any cause, just as all demands are not reasonable neither are all offenses. Does the color blue harm me in any way? does it harm him? For if the only harm done is an offense to my eye or ear then again, that offense is not reasonable. It is through this sentiment that we can at last notice how business has used doublespeak to turn freedom on its head and weaponize it to great effect against us.
We are told that the choices that do matter don't and the ones that don't matter do! We are told that it is important we allow mercury and lead in our drinking water because it saves money! Yet we have a vested interest in enshrining entirely subjective morality into law. I REJECT this, I reject the belief that encourages selfishness as the only definition of happiness. If you cannot be happy unless your way of life is the law, then you do not deserve to be happy. But do NOT confuse to whom I am addressing that statement. It is to those who define their way of life as hatred, it is those who define their way of life as intolerance, it is those who cannot be happy unless ALL children are learning bigotry in school for no other reason then they cannot stand the loss of control they suffer when their own children do not grow up just as filled with bile as they are.
These people were entirely created because of money, because of structures of power. They are the unfortunate effects of human nature. Business funnels no small amount of money to these individuals and seeks in no small part to engorge their ranks as often as they can. They give paid-for media megaphones to blast their vitriolic message of misinformation across every corner of the nation, spreading lies and misinformation under the guise of authority. They prey on human nature, on trust and they hijack religions they hijack politics, they hijack unions, they hijack movements. They use their influence and hammer, chip and grate away at us until we start to believe them and then, after finally collapsing intellectually under the sheer weight of their ability to divide and conquer us they pit us against one another so we would never realize how it all got started. That we would never realize who our friends and enemies really are.
We all can achieve equality and justice under the law, there is no reason that your freedom and my freedom should EVER TRULY be in conflict. And anyone who tells you otherwise is TRYING TO CONTROL YOU! (or has been coerced into it by someone else who is) Yes, there is some overlap. The rights of individuals to freely organize is tantamount to democracy and the foundation of this movement. But the right to freely assemble is one thing, the right for individuals to reach a collective decision is one thing. It is another when you enter a legally binding contract to enter a commercial enterprise? Why? It all goes back to money, money IS coercion, and while money is not evil the pursuit of money is the pursuit of power, and it must be regulated justly so that neither may create tyrants over our lives.
Profound analyses to heed
Submitted by Kate89 on
Profound analyses, I think your level of discussion is deep and it will take me and many others some time to digest the message. I hope your viewpoint gets consideration when the Occupy movement can translate its action into national reforms.
It must be regulated justly
Submitted by Jo Terry on
Submitted by Jo Terry on Sat, 11/05/2011 - 5:12pm
Who regulates money? Policy by reps keeps money regulated among we the people. Reagan's voodoo policy was a departure. Our New Guard Association is always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption. Your thoughts?
How about embracing the Occam's Razor Principle for starters?
Submitted by alhs06 on
The basic Principle of "Occam's Razor", slightly modified from the original authors, Franciscan friar William of Ockham, meaning, "In most cases the simplest choice is the best choice." I realize that a statement like that made here, in California, is not very popular, where we like to do everything the hard way
If Occupy plans on folding up the tent's for good, after our initial campaign, I would agree to a All Inclusive, Multi Issue Document of Our most Critical Path Issues and our solution's, feasible or not, that would prevent our country as well as the world from a permanent Economical melt down. But that's not the case.
We need to formally introduce ourselves to the World as a Brilliant Anomaly, something the Modern World would witness for the first time,
A Pure, Unified & Unconditionally United American Public, with no political or ethnic or age or gender labels, all with the same goal clearly in mind, for your review and comment, my drafting of a "Declaration of Re-Occupation by the 99%"
There you go, I realize that the act of treason might be a bit harsh and extreme, but that's how I feel about the mess we were presented with by them.
Who will deal swiftly, strictly with the same compassion ?
Submitted by Jo Terry on
We the people are to provide a new guard for our future security. The simplest choice is the best choice. They have been dealing out indictments for over 200 years. We are always working with congress to pass our New Guard funding bill. It promises to remove the corrupt from government and never passes. The only reason for this is we need a 60% for it to pass and the corrupt have grown beyond 60%. Maybe now they will finally pass it. Simple? All we need do is pressure congress to fund our New Guard. The council supervises this guard and thats it, pretty simple. To bring you up to speed. We the 99ers are to provide New Guards for our future security. This New Guard has been developed, tested, refined and proven by 99ers in Scandinavian countries. We no longer have the luxury of time to experiment with unproven mandates. This system has been adopted by 25 OECD nations along with two U.S. states. It stops police abuse and corruption in government. There are no detractors.
We were given a duty by our founding Patrons to provide New Guards for our future security after proof that the old guards had been corrupted. The corrupt have been playing a game on us and we are occupying as we grow. The vote the general Assembly must call for comes from the question Do we want to go into their game with or without the chess queen piece known as the New Guard. A yes vote will put these public commissioned plenipotentiaries between police abuse and the occupyers. These Investigators out rank the police and all officials as to end abuse and corruption. We were given a duty now lets call for a vote as to fulfill on this duty and protect the occupyers as well as the 99ers. I can answer all your questions on this detractorless unanomous vote. Even the 1% will vote for this as they understand a need for a Patron to protect the progeny from depredators. Reversing corporate personhood got a 76% vote. This will get a 100% vote. Workable and congress is already well aware of this plenipotentiary who investigates abuse and corruption.
repeal SBX211 No more immunity from prosecution
Submitted by dan cooper on
HISTORY OF RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY IN THE UNITED STATES
1. given for unconstitutional use of torture
2. given for illegal merger of banks (we can see the effects of that now)
3. given to telecom company for illegal wire taps. (Fisa bill that led to the patriot act)
4. given to Judges for taking bribes. (SBX211)
SBX211 Retro Active Immunity given to California judges for openly taking bribes. Judges are employees of the state they receive their pay and benefits from the state. The Los Angeles Superior court judges are currently receiving an additional $57.688,00 from the county of Los Angeles. there is no bigger user of the court than L.A. County.(A party to the case and has a financial interest in most cases in the courts) Those payments were found to be unconstitutional / illegal in Sturgeon vs Los angeles County. After that decision the judges paid a lobbyist to pass SBX211 ( RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY )
SBX211 does not restore due process
SBX211 violates Article 1 section 9
SBX211 violates the 14th amendment (no equal protections)
SBX211 violate checks and balances between legislative and Judicial powers.
Judges do not disclose the county payments at the onset of any trial where the county is either a party to the case or has a financial interest. (Judges violate Judicial codes of ethics)
Judges refuse to recuse themselves when requested under CCP170
Judges find themselves unbiased and then file an order striking statement.
Not only do judges get paid a state salary of $178,789.00 a year with medical and retirement benefits up to 75% of their salary, with the county payments the Los Angeles Superior court judges are the highest paid judges in the Nation. Los Angeles County takes tax payer money and then gives the judges that money to only have the judges rule against the tax payer in favor of L.A. County or the County's interest. THE BRIBES WORK.
SBX211 is evidence of conspiracy of the California legislative branch of government to cover up the multiple felony's committed by the Judicial branch of government. By an act of Legislation, California's judicial branch has admitted to be corrupt.
SECTION FROM SBX211
This bill would provide that no governmental entity, or officer or employee of a governmental entity, shall incur any liability or be subject to prosecution or disciplinary action because of benefits provided to a judge under the official action of a governmental entity prior to the effective date of this bill on the ground that those benefits were not authorized under law.
If government would only adhere to their sworn oath to uphold the Constitution and the laws we would not be in this horrible mess. But instead they take bribes/ campaign contributions and either give massive bail outs or they violate the Constitution by granting Retro Active Immunity from prosecution.
Robert kennedy spoke out against retro active immunity..."QUOTE" (The very idea of "retroactive immunity" ... is so radical, so repugnant to the most basic principles of the "rule of law," that only one prior attempt can be found in recent history (at least from my research): the efforts by some in Congress (in 1965) to enact a law retroactively legalizing the mergers by six large banks which clearly -- as a federal court found -- were illegal under our nation's antitrust laws.
The banks knew when they merged that they were almost certainly violating anti-trust laws. But they did it anyway. And when courts began ruling that their behavior was illegal, they ran to Congress to demand that a law be passed granting them amnesty, claiming that the consequences would be ruinous if they were held accountable under the law. But the very concept of retroactive amnesty, the idea that corporations could break the law and then have Congress pass a special law legalizing their lawbreaking conduct, was so profoundly offensive to Sen. Robert Kennedy (who had been the Attorney General when the banks broke the law with their mergers), as well as then-Attorney General Nicholas Katzenbach, that they engaged in extraordinary efforts to try to put a stop to this Congressional travesty.
If Robert Kennedy was able to stop them at that time in our history then we would most certainly not be in this position today. What will happen in the future now that it is legal for judges to take bribes? How could you bring evidence of corruption and violations of the LAW when you have a court that has been granted RETRO ACTIVE IMMUNITY for taking bribes.
The change must start with the courts. Without a fair and unbiased court you can not have JUSTICE, YOU CAN NOT HAVE THE RIGHT OF DUE PROCESS. In the constitution the right to due process is stated over and over again. Our founding fathers knew the dangers when judges could be bought. They knew the dangers when the financial institutions became too big.
CURRENTLY THE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF CALIFORNIA IS IN NEGOTIATIONS WITH BANKS, THE BANKS ARE REQUESTING AMNISTY / IMMUNITY FOR ILLEGAL PORCLOSURES.
REPEAL SBX211 GIVE THE COURTS BACK TO THE PEOPLE,
An idea
Submitted by Tomicus on
I agree that demands should be kept short, simple and doable. I love all of the suggestions but I think they need to be sorted into short term/long term.
For short term, I would love to see two:
1) Pay Ceiling. Enact a law that states that no one at a company may be paid higher than 20 times the average salary of a companies work force.
2) Reduce work week from 40 hours to 32 hours.
I've posted an article at http://www.narfus.com/node/11 explains my thinking and why these two demands go to the heart of a large inequity Its a bit long for this forum.
Thank you, all of you, for all you're doing. OWS rocks.
Tom
Request for list of preliminary demands from GA of Oct. 23
Submitted by charliehbryan on
Last Sunday, I attended GA and a member from the Demands and Objectives Committee read off a 'preliminary' list of demands. Trouble is, the speaker read it so fast and light was so dark that I could not get it down in writing.
Does anyone reading this forum have the list of demands read last Sunday (Oct 23) at GA?
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